Confused Man Wears Mask In Spite of Having Had Virus Months Ago
This picture really does take the biscuit. Why is Boris bothering to wear a mask when he cannot possibly be infectious or catch COVID-19, having had the virus and recovered. Like me, he has the antibodies. Nicola Sturgeon may have made mask wearing in shops mandatory in Scotland on Friday, but no such rule applies in Uxbridge. So what is the big man thinking? Is this a signal that he’s about to follow in Sturgeon’s footsteps? The Mail seems to think so.
In the early days of the outbreak the UK Government argued that scientific evidence that the masks reduced transmission of the airborne virus was “weak”.
But rules requiring people to wear face masks on public transport in England came into effect on 15 June.
On Friday Mr Johnson said “the balance of scientific opinion seems to have shifted more in favour of them than it was, and we’re very keen to follow that”.
“I do think we need to be stricter in insisting people wear face coverings in confined spaces where they are meeting people they don’t normally meet.
“We are looking at ways of making sure that people really do have face coverings in shops, for instance, where there is a risk of transmission,” he said during a Facebook Q&A.
Gawd help us if he does decide to wet the bed over masks. One reader – let’s call him Tony – has already been in touch to say the very thought of having to wear a nappy on his face every time he leaves the house is making him feel suicidal.
Send Tony some love in the comments.
Stop Press: There seems to be a great deal of confusion about whether face masks should be worn in some of Britain’s most popular galleries and museums. You’ll be required to wear one at the BFI Southbank when it re-opens on September 1st, as well as the Royal Academy, while the National Gallery merely “encourages” visitors to wear one and the Tate doesn’t require them at all. Go figure.
When We Have Herd Immunity, Boris Will Face a Reckoning
I have a piece in the Telegraph today, arguing that the reason the virus is burning itself out in Britain, Europe and parts of America is because we’re on our way to achieving herd immunity in those areas.
At the beginning of March, a lively debate took place about whether Britain should pursue a strategy of “herd immunity” – allowing coronavirus to spread until so many people had developed antibodies that it no longer posed a threat to public health – or place the entire country under lockdown. As is well-known, Boris Johnson initially embraced the former, saying the public needed to take the virus “on the chin”, then performed a U-turn and imposed a full lockdown on March 23.
But recent data coming out of New York reveals that this was a false dichotomy. Sixty-eight per cent of people who took antibody tests at a clinic in the Corona neighbourhood of Queens received positive results, suggesting that, in this area at least, the population is already close to achieving “herd immunity”. This is in spite of the fact that New York imposed one of the strictest lockdowns in the United States.
This fits with other data showing that the life cycle of the epidemic in each region or country where there’s been a viral outbreak follows a very similar pattern, regardless of whether or not a lockdown was imposed or how severe it was. For instance, if you plot the rise and fall in the number of new cases in Sweden on a graph, and then compare it to the same data in the UK, the two lines are almost identical, in spite of the fact that Sweden never imposed a lockdown. The same is true if you compare the trajectory of the virus in the 43 US states that locked down with the seven that didn’t.
The Telegraph wasn’t able to reproduce the graph I had in mind because it appeared in the Spectator. But this is the one I was referring to, which was in an article by Lockdown Sceptics contributor Alistair Haimes.
The fact that the pattern is so similar, regardless of which non-pharmaceutical interventions were made, suggests the reason the R rate has fallen to below one in these areas has nothing to do with the lockdowns and everything to do with the fact that a majority of people have now been exposed to the virus and either had natural immunity or caught it and are now immune. As I point out in the article, that’s good news because it means the chances of a ‘second wave’ happening are virtually nil. But it’s bad news for Boris.
As it becomes clearer that the British population will soon achieve herd immunity, just as the population of Corona has, and the lockdown has done nothing to mitigate the impact of the virus, people will begin to ask tough questions of the Government. And Boris won’t be able to say we only know this now with the benefit of hindsight because he recognised the wisdom of the “herd immunity” strategy back in March. Whatever his excuse is, it will have to be better than that if the Conservatives are going to survive the reckoning.
Worth reading in full.
Escape to the Costa Blanca
A Scottish reader has been in touch about his escape to Spain. Not quite the idyll he was expecting…
I thought I would give you a quick insight into life in the Costa Blanca, Spain. We escaped Nicola (Bane) Sturgeon a few weeks ago, thinking we were smart. We have had a great time here, but there are potential signs of things to come back in the UK:
1. The wearing of masks is obligatory in all shops. I watched a guy getting manhandled out of Lidl yesterday because he was attempting to cover his mouth with his T-shirt. My wife and I were smirking until I was approached by the same hit squad who had so efficiently dispatched him. I was wearing my usual bandanna, but this was obviously not up to the required standard for this supermarket and I was accompanied out faster than a lizard finds the shade. So now it appears masks have to be of a specific type. Could it happen in the UK next?
2. A new hotel and restaurant opened up on the waterfront in our town. Lovely job. Three days later it was closed down. All the furniture was removed and it was completely de-fumigated. Apparently, the owner was suspected of having Covid. Turned out, he didn’t. He had had a car accident two days before and wasn’t feeling too well. He got a complete decontamination exercise for his trouble. Hysterical. Not seen anyone in it since!
3. It’s great that the shops are open, but it’s becoming a health hazard for your hands. You have to disinfect on entry and exit. Visit five shops and that’s a lot of chemicals. And how my hands are suffering. Dry and itchy. I tried to pretend to have a squirt on them the other day and the “doorman” reprimanded me for it. Scary…
4. It is becoming increasingly bizarre to see waiters having to wear masks in restaurants while the customers don’t. In this heat (up to 40 degrees) it’s downright dangerous. Most of them look completely pissed off wearing them. Will there be a health fallout from such intense mask wearing?
5. When we did a runner a few weeks ago we just about had the plane to ourselves flying out of Glasgow. We thought we were the smart ones. But Nicola’s decided that we have to serve two weeks solitary when we return, e.g. quarantine. She can’t be beaten, but we won’t give up trying!
Perhaps it isn’t all Wee Krankie’s fault. One of her public health advisers, Professor Devi Sridhar, is a bedwetter par excellence. She took to Twitter recently to warn of “constant outbreaks” as lockdown restrictions ease across the country. She said the virus was likely to be present in the UK until at least the spring of 2021 and that if people returned to their normal patterns of behaviour “we will get an uptick for sure”.
I know the economy is suffering and jobs are being lost. I recognise the toll that lockdown has taken and I’m not ‘pro-lockdown’ at all.
In fact my worry is about a second lockdown and how to avoid this happening. Lockdown/release cycles will destroy society and the economy.
That’s a new one on me: I’m so worried about the toll the lockdown is taking that I think we should continue to strictly maintain it to avoid having to re-impose it.
Canaries in the Mine Update
I’m publishing a third article in Dr Rudolph Kalveks ‘Canaries in the Mine’ series today. Dr Kalveks, who has a PhD in theoretical physics, has used a standard tool in epidemiology – the Susceptible–Infected–Recovered/Resolved or (“SIR”) model – to analyse the lifecycle of the virus in different countries and he concluded in the first article in the series that in Europe and America the pandemic was approaching the end of its life and a “second wave” was unlikely. He looked at the data again in the second article in the series and saw nothing to change his mind, and he’s done the same in the third. Again, the data confirms his initial hypothesis:
Notwithstanding that populations are not homogeneous, so that there may remain local groups of vulnerable individuals who may continue to benefit from continued sheltering, the simple message for UK policymakers is that the historic data from the Coronavirus pandemic does not at present provide evidence to support the continuation of substantial restrictions on the normal functioning of our society and economy.
Worth reading in full.
Letter in Harpers Raising Alarm About the Intolerant Left Makes it Harder to Deny Cancel Culture
I appeared on Sky News earlier to debate Guardian columnist Owen Jones about cancel culture, following the letter that appeared in Harpers last week signed by 153 left-wing writers and intellectuals. Owen tweeted on July 5th that he didn’t think cancel culture existed, in spite of the fact that a couple of weeks ago he led demands for Oxford University’s Deputy Director of External Affairs to be fired “by the end of the day” because he’d tweeted something disobliging about Owen’s friend Ash Sarkar.
It’s like the leader of the Red Guards at the height of the Chinese Cultural Revolution saying, “Struggle sessions? What struggle sessions?”
Round-Up
And on to the round-up of all the stories I’ve noticed, or which have been been brought to my attention, in the last 24 hours:
- ‘Welsh pubs and cafes to reopen indoors on 3 August‘ – Welsh pubs, cafes, bars and restaurants can open with outside seating from Monday, indoors from August 3rd
- ‘Quarantine rules end for dozens of destinations‘ – Rules are being relaxed for arrivals from 75 countries and British overseas territories, although travellers from Spain still have to quarantine on arrival in Scotland (see above)
- ‘Multiple errors in the New York Times article about Sweden’s corona strategy‘ – Good takedown of the misleading New York Times piece headlined: “Sweden has become the world’s cautionary tale.”
- ‘Sickest coronavirus patients could be injected with lab-made antibodies to help fight off infection‘ – Story in the Telegraph about an experimental new treatment. I first read about this at least six weeks ago
- ‘We’re keeping the flirty young things apart, say publicans‘ – According to the Times, publicans have been struggling to keep young people from snogging
- ‘COVID-19 is not a “serious and imminent danger”. Risk assessments might be‘ – Employment lawyers Jackson Osborne point out that the HSE’s Covid risk assessment approach is fundamentally flawed
- ‘Jeremy Hunt interview: “The scientific advice was wrong — there was group-think at the top”‘ – I got my hopes up when I read that headline, but in fact he means the Government didn’t lock down early enough. Yawn
- ‘Global socio-economic losses and environmental gains from the Coronavirus pandemic‘ – The first comprehensive study of the pandemic by a group of international academics shows consumption losses amount to more than $3.8 trillion, triggering full-time equivalent job losses of 147 million
- ‘People WON’T obey lockdown again‘ – SAGE has warned that it will be a lot harder to get people to stick to the rules if a full lockdown is reimposed
- ‘Civil servants are told to read up on Dominic Cummings as overhaul looms‘ – Turns out, the Cabinet Office has drawn up a 20-page synopsis of Dominic Cummings’s famously prolix blog posts so incoming officials can brief themselves on the great man’s thoughts
- ‘What’s the true cost of lockdown?‘ – Good piece in the Spectator by Dr Waqar Rashid, a consultant neurologist at St George’s University Foundation Hospital NHS Trust, about the psychological toll
Small Businesses That Have Re-Opened
A few weeks ago, Lockdown Sceptics launched a searchable directory of open businesses across the UK. The idea is to celebrate those retail and hospitality businesses that have re-opened, as well as help people find out what has opened in their area. But we need your help to build it, so we’ve created a form you can fill out to tell us about those businesses that have opened near you. Now that non-essential shops have re-opened – or most of them, anyway – we’re now focusing on pubs, bars, clubs and restaurants, as well as other social venues. As of July 4th, many of them have re-opened too, but not all. Please visit the page and let us know about those brave folk who are doing their bit to get our country back on its feet. Don’t worry if your entries don’t show up immediately – we need to approve them once you’ve entered the data.
Note to the Good Folk Below the Line
I enjoy reading all your comments and I’m glad I’ve created a “safe space” for lockdown sceptics to share their frustrations and keep each other’s spirits up. But please don’t copy and paste whole articles from papers that are behind paywalls in the comments. I work for some of those papers and if they don’t charge for premium content they won’t survive.
I know it becomes difficult to navigate the comment threads after 24 hours. One alternative to continuing to post below my updates is to move to the forum on Lockdown Truth. The creator of that site has extended a warm welcome to everyone here.
Shameless Begging Bit
Thanks as always to those of you who made a donation in the last 48 hours to pay for the upkeep of this site. It usually takes me several hours to do these updates, which doesn’t leave much time for other work. If you feel like donating, however small the amount, please click here. And if you want to flag up any stories or links I should include in future updates, email me here. (Please don’t email me at any other address.) I’ll try and get another update done on Tuesday.
And Finally…
To join in with the discussion please make a donation to The Daily Sceptic.
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Toby, you say that Johnson had Covid-19 – do you not find it quite extraordinary that a man released from intensive care was pictured a week or two later doing press-ups?
I do not believe he had it at all.
How time flies, BJ went into IC on 7th April, the press-ups interview was published on 28th June. More than ‘a week or two’.
Thanks — you’re right.
Maybe so, but I still don’t believe he had it.
What he had was “mild ICU”. He spent time there just being watched and sniffing extra oxygen, and not intubated. If that’s all you get you are fine once you kick the virus.
I think he just had surgery to remove his brain. Minor operation, very small organ.
The larger organ, unfortunately, is what he is lead around by.
Do you mean Cummings…?
Surely both of them have the same drain brain.
It is made from heavy metal? Oh, led?
Makes sense! 🙂
I didn’t know he had one.
Replaced with a lizard brain, no doubt!
I’m starting to think he’s been replaced by a woke clone.
I’ve often wondered if there was a psychosomatic element to Johnson’s illness.
I won’t be surprised if there is. Not to mention having a new OH and baby would I suspect cloud his brain and judgement.
He was in ICU but never on a ventilator. It’s the use of a ventilator that is so debilitating for many months afterwards. It can take 12 months to recover just from the use of a ventilator – let alone whatever else you were suffering from making a ventilator necessary
I think he had a mental breakdown, and needed rest and recuperation out of the public eye for a couple of weeks.
And Bill Gates wanted him out of the way.
His MK Ultra programming needed re booting so he would no longer have any morals or conscience to get in the as he and Prick Hancock destroy Britain.
Providing he had any to start with.
I think his election campaign proved him completely devoid of both morals and conscience.
Interesting thought
Hadn’t thought of that one. It would explain a lot, including that new ‘I think I may be on dodgy ground here’ look when he’s been talking about certain things. Whatever happened, his brane has certainly not been functioning in the same way it was last autumn/winter.
There was something weird he said afterwards: “They gave me litres and litres of oxygen”. As if the main descriptive term for oxygen is its “litresness”. To me, it seemed like a line fed to him by a medic rather than something a real person would actually say. Like being shot at and saying “There were grammes and grammes of lead heading for me”.
Yes, I can’t think of specific examples, but I’ve noticed that he’s been ‘a lot less than fluent’ in what he’s had to say, and in the way he’s said it, on a number of occasions in recent weeks. Maybe it’s just sleepless nights with ‘t baby? (Though I’d be surprised if they haven’t a maternity nurse in to do all the night shifts, at least.) Whatever the case, something about him has changed.
UK government to invest £170,000 in elite sex-parties firm, with taxpayer holding equity stake – media report
https://www.rt.com/uk/494404-sex-parties-government-funds/
Phew. Shopping done today, more than usual, should keep us going for several weeks while I sort out online alternatives if our usual haunts submit to the mask culture. Just as a reminder of the arrogance displayed by some shops, a barber in Clevedon is now open, with a sign outside his shop. “by appointment only. No mask, no service”. Very abrupt and in yer face. I’d tell him to shove it. There is really no need for such wording on people’s boards. Hope he goes bust. But he won’t. Mind you, there was no one in there on both the occasions I passed by, and it is a Saturday….in the past he’s been queued out the door.
Same here , they can all get stuffed. I will not wear a mask . I will keep my money until this madness is over …and I don’t mean any virus
That’s exactly what I am going to do and they can all get stuffed!
The polar opposite of a friendly welcome, that sign!
If he’s no business, then hopefully he will go bust.
‘You went off the rails into insanity’: BAFTA takes heat online for imposing diversity quotas for Games Awards contestants
https://www.rt.com/uk/494370-bafta-games-diversity-online/
Boris looks such a plonker wearing the ill fitting blue face nappy. I had a deja vu of a stag party where the chubby host ended up with the strippers blue silk thong stretched over his head .
He really has been a disappointment.
OMG I can’t get that picture out of my head, Peter!
If this is an attempt by Boris to make us all feel safer when we shop or work (and most of us have been happy to shop and work since March, without wearing a face nappy) what sort of message is it trying to portray? You wouldn’t want to visit somewhere where a bullet proof vest was a requirement because that wouldn’t be a safe place, would it?
This chap solved the problem in February. https://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/video-shopkeeper-coronavirus-face-mask-union-jack-thong-a4371761.html
I thought it telling that of the other three people in the picture, two were completely maskless and the other had tucked his under his chin!
It also looks like one of those pointless and useless surgical masks. that masks is fine in a surgery scenario situation but as for stopping the virus? Nah. Just a load of totalitarian control freak BS. The demonstrably racist fascist dirty filthy cheating lying cheating Chinese must be falling over themselves laughing.
‘disappointment’?
Please accept the Annie Award for Understatement of the Year!
Peter, you can have the Miriam Medal as 2nd prize for the same achievement!
Also, isn’t it time Toby Young could come up with something better than calling Johnson a ‘bedwetter’ when he is apparently about to introduce such a draconian, humiliating, antisocial and destructive measure as the epidemic is now over. Surely you could risk speculating just what the man’s game is?
We all know this is not about a virus and not about our safety. I’m not sure that it ever was.
As I said below the previous post, Guantanamo Bay prisoners were kept kneeling, apart, hooded and forced to wear the same blue face masks that you see everywhere now. Well, it made us think when we saw the photo.
Of course. it is not about the virus. It’s all about the vaccine and keeping the fear factor going until they’ve got enough of Gates’s toxic special brew to genocide us all at one sitting. The UK government has been up to its stinking armpits in this whole wretched corona farce since day one. We are in very desperate trouble.
They’ll be telling us to wear orange next!
We’ve got a similar picture in our front window, highlighting the mask and with the slogan ‘As worn in Guantanamo since 2002’
I posted earlier but if you refuse to wear the mask does that mean that Boris intends for people to starve or wear a mask, is he actually saying and is it the case for the Scots that if you refuse to cover your face in a shop, you cannot by food and that is supported by the British Government?
The terrifying thing is, some earnest highly paid focus group probably met late into the night to discuss the best design for the PM’s face mask for this shot, to instill optimum voter confidence. “PPE mask?” “No, too contentious.” “How about a rainbow?” “No, no, let’s make it … NHS Blue!!!”
Conservative blue??? Let’s face it, he would never wear a red one!
Krankies had to be fashioned out of the corner of an old shopping trolley bag. I believe the mask is a statement about the simplicity of the wearers brain.
He ought to have a very red face.
To be fair he looks a plonker even without one.
Gawd. I can’t unsee that!
Zoinks!!!
His mask looks like a jockstrap!
That’s because his face looks like a ,,,,,,,,,,,,
Well, it is covering a prick.
Mandatory face masks will be introduced in England next week, I have no doubt. Boris can’t lose with this one. If he makes them mandatory then when there isn’t a second wave he (and all the face mask fans as well ) can say it was entirely because people had to wear masks everywhere. If there is a second wave then he can spin it that a second wave was always predicted and how much worse it would be without mask use. How can anyone prove different – just like with Ferguson’s crappy model back in March. Mask wearing seems to be what a majority of the public want – why would he go against that when he’s already let the media and the public bounce him into a lockdown? I think he knows it will have no actual impact on virus spread but if it’s what the public want and (he thinks) will persuade people back into the shops and pubs then it’s an easy decision for him. The question is – will the Welsh Government continue to resist the pressure against face masks? If England shift position I can’t see them holding out for long but they’ve said… Read more »
Wow, are you telling me that our anti-mask hopes rest with the Welsh government?!
They’ve been surprisingly militant in their assessment of the efficacy of face masks. Given their ultra cautious approach in every other aspect of the lockdown it’s beyond unexpected.
Not disagreeing – I called it a few days ago -masks next week. But he can lose. If people outright reject en mass. Its not the woke Scottish with the scot nat fan base he’s dealing with. Police cannot enforce. Social shaming unlikely in England. I think there’s room for a massive misjudgement at this stage of their game.
Do you think people will reject it outright though? I have no faith in the majority of the British public. Certainly the overwhelming view point I see from my Facebook friends is that everyone should wear face masks at all times. Of course social media is probably not the best place for assessing real world attitude but even so I think once it’s mandatory people will comply.
Yes. Huge pockets of folk. Much more so than here. Genuinely. Liverpool, Leeds, Manchester, Sunderland, Walsall, Wolves, Stoke… these are places with sensible no nonsense folk in them. Hartlepool, Whitby! I sound like a lemon jelly tune but! I grant you Ipswich and Bath might go along.
The sell isn’t comolete in my estimation.
But as I said, I did call it as a done deal by next week.
I am originally from Manchester…its no longer as you say…Chorlton,Withington,Didsbury etc are full of woke PC loons.
If 61% are in favour of deleting their isn noses and mouths, that leaves 39% who are not.That’s a lot of unhappy humans. They need nudging.
Think its time to ditch your facebook friends….with friends like thsese…….
Very few people have been wearing masks here (present at bus stops under the chin but virtually none before 15 Jun ).
Today there were even less than usual in supermarkets.
It’s almost a tacit response to ‘no mask’; ‘no antisocial distancing’
How about sending truckloads of masks to the BBC, #10 Downing Street and the House of Parliament for starters? Pick them at the Underground and deposit them in boxes at a makeshift pickup station where you exit?
Most people in Yarm where I live are not wearing masks. This suggests to me that in Yarm at least people don’t want to wear them as if they did they would be wearing them. I am so angry and disillusioned with Boris Johnson.
A disappointment to some, but for others he has lived down to expectations.
I thought he looked as if he’s got a pair of knickers on his face!
I look at Boris and all that comes to mind is that somewhere there is a village missing its idiot.
Serbian police arrest 71 protesters, including Brit, as mayhem over Covid-19 restrictions continues
https://www.rt.com/news/494478-serbia-belgrade-protest-arrests/
Ruptly youtube continue to stream live the protests. Peaceful presently.
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/coronavirus-in-japan-tokyo-rejects-lockdown-despite-surge-dnrsstppc
Coronavirus in Japan: Tokyo rejects lockdown despite
Coronavirus: Sweden’s death rate falling faster than the UK’s
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8505699/amp/Swedens-coronavirus-death-rate-falling-faster-UKs.html
In that Mail-on-line article they poll 61% want masks, as in Scotland.
This is ‘The Science’ the Government follows, so, it’ll be an announcement on Monday for England then.
but also in The Daily Mail:
Coronavirus: Sweden’s death rate falling faster than the UK’s
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8505699/amp/Swedens-coronavirus-death-rate-falling-faster-UKs.html
I don’t believe these polls. If this is true, why is it that where I live in Essex no more than 5% are wearing masks to shop. If they were worried enough to report their preference for masks, they’d be wearing them now, wouldn’t they?
I see YouGov have just put out another poll stating that “only” 38% of British people wear masks, compared with much higher percentages elsewhere in Europe:
https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1281638035462004739
This is absolute bollocks! I’ve been out and about quite a bit recently and I would estimate fewer than 5% wear masks. These polls as misleading at best, downright lies at worst.
Agree – 5% max in my area
Same in Yarm on Teesside
virtually no one was wearing them in Scotland before she made us and now almost everyone is wearing them.
Inside I agree. Outside not so much and also early days… let time pass and people think bugger it, this truly is pointless and no police doing anything (they can’t). There’s a lot of good in junk rules being brought in for people to see through them and grow past them. Patience! Hope!
Boris is in a cracking position. His masters want him to do it. He knows the population won’t follow suit. Bring in a law tgat people flout immediately isn’t the best way to look strong.
Sturgeon feels untouchable, she needs kicking out.
Kicking certainly, and I can think of a few more locations.
Keep Kicking Marxists…someone has a breitbart profile with that name lol
Yep, I’m wearing them in shops too now. Ineffetually perched on the end of my nose so my breath bypasses the mask and doesn’t fog up my glasses. So they’re quite tolerable to wear this way. I’ve had to wear a fair variety of masks in my chequered work history, from dust masks to full breathing apparatus, so I’m pretty much au fait with how to make a mask work, if there’s any significant risk I know full well how to wear the thing properly. In the meantime I’m basically pretending to wear one.
‘in Europe’… where in Europe? Certainly not everywhere..No Scandinavian countries have mandated masks, nor are they likely to!
I think 38% SAY they wear them to the pollsters. But when they go out…. they actually don’t.
I think the polls are skewed and the papers are happy to report them.
And of course pollsters always tell it like it is.
Went to the park this afternoon. It was busy. No masks, except for one South Asian man whose wife and kid were maskless.
If this is accurate why are – my very rough estimate, in my local area – only 10-20% of people wearing one when out shopping currently?
I’d say about….. maybe only 1 in 50 round where I live.
Much less than 5% in my locality. Did a big shop on Thursday, saw just one masked plonker in a mask in the car park. None in the supermarket, including staff.
None at all in Aldi last night.
Don’t trust these polls and surveys, must be fake.
I don’t see all that many of them about where I live, but I suspect that many of the worst covid bedwetters are barricading themselves inside their homes.
So while the figure does seem really high, it may be that those out on the streets are less fearful anyway.
This makes no sense. If 61% wanted compulsory muzzling there is nothing to stop them having warn masks for the last 3 months yet I would say no more than 5% of people wear them in south Derbyshire where I live.
Whichever side you take in the lockdown debate you take, you would expect the virus to fall off more quickly in a country which didn’t lockdown, having experienced a bigger wave of cases in the first place. I’m definitely an opponent of lockdown however I’m disappointed that Sweden hasn’t experienced a greater decrease in covid mortality, it seems more likely that lockdown or lack of has made no difference to the curve.
“people will begin to ask tough questions of the Government” – yeah, right.
Re Toby’s cancel culture discussion on sky
This is the correct link
The one he has takes you to the Ice Cold in Alex lager clip … (unless John Mills is Toby and Sylvia Sims is Owen Jones
It´s been cancelled
Coronavirus furlough windfall for big businesses
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/coronavirus-furlough-windfall-for-big-businesses-pkw8zh92z
The law of unintended consequences
Paywall! Give us the juicy bits please …..
Rishi Sunak, the chancellor, has defended the £9 billion bonus scheme that will pay £1,000 to companies for each worker taken back from furlough.
Labour has criticised the policy, saying that it would subsidise firms that planned to bring workers back anyway and was not a big enough inducement to prevent redundancies.
The plan was also questioned by Mel Stride, the Conservative chairman of the Treasury select committee, after it emerged that officials had refused to sign off the plan because they were uncertain of its value for money.
Here Cheezilla:
Shares in some high street companies rallied as investors caught on to the prospect of a one-off boost from furlough bonuses in January.
JD Wetherspoon, which put 43,000 people on furlough, is potentially eligible for £43 million, if all employees returned within the timeframe. Also likely to benefit are Marks & Spencer, which furloughed 27,000 workers, and Next, which furloughed 44,000.
In a letter to the chancellor, Jim Harra, head of HM Revenue & Customs, said that while there was a “sound policy rationale” for the scheme he was “unable to reach a view that this represents value for money”. Under spending rules officials are required to request a written ministerial direction for any policy where they cannot demonstrate value for money from the taxpayer.
Robert Joyce, of the Institute of Fiscal Studies, said while it was not a “small” subsidy it might not be enough to make a difference. “In a normal time that is not at all a small subsidy, but it is a lot less than we had been providing through the furlough scheme and in these times it is doubtful how many jobs that might save if labour demand continues to be very weak.”
Thanks H.A. 🙂
Interesting video https://youtu.be/7NCD6lvxlKY from Tony Heller about the number of virus’s that emanate from the place called Wuhan. 1996, 2009 and the latest.
Boris and his cabinet should face a ‘reckoning’ now
I’m sharpening my flaying knives and studying pictures of St Lawrence on the gridiron.
Boris and his cabinet are desperate, flailing around blaming everybody but themselves: supposed sweat shops, care homes, Sage, PHE. Good grief, even Jeremy Hunt is accusing the ‘Science’ of groupthink. Overall, not a pretty sight, but it shows the heat is being felt.
There is no heat because there is no opposition. And if you have no opposition you can do what you want with alacrity.
A friend of mine has been telling me about the abrupt mental decline over the last few weeks of two elderly neighbours, who each live on their own.
‘Reckoning’? I hope that bastard Johnson swings for what he’s done.
Sadly the same is true of my 90yo father. Former managing director of a multi national company his decline, particularly verbal reasoning, in the last 3 months has been shocking. Confined to his flat, unable to master basic IT, his children and grandchildren forbidden to visit until last weekend, no church, no friends, no trips to town on his scooter. He seems to have filled his time writing lists in respect of his funeral arrangements. He’s just given up.
That is very very sad and hard to hear. I feels so angry as I am in a similar situation with my father living in a care home
Thanks. My heart breaks for them both. Sending you a virtual hug. If we were in the same room it would be a real one!
Very sorry as well. My father-in-law lives on his own and while he’s fairly competent with IT and is in better shape this year than he has been two years ago, he’s fed up and wants his life back.
My dad is at the point where he’d rather have a few weeks of normal than a year or two of continued isolation. Reminds me of a quote from Steel Magnolias “I’d rather have five minutes of wonderful than a lifetime of nothing special”.
Yeah, my father-in-law said as much – he misses going to concerts and eating out. He went to central Edinburgh for the first time in three months and he noticed how depressing everything was.
And that’s without bumping into wee Jimmie.
That’s very sad to hear and it makes me angry that lockdownistas still think the right thing was done.
NO! NO! NO!
If only a prime minister still said that in the house of commons lol
So sorry for you. They embarked on this hideous lockdown it would seem without any thoughts of the consequences on the economy, education, health including mental health and what it would do to elderly people. It’s inforgivable.
That is appalling. And the worst thing, for the rest of us, is the thought of how many people could tell, and are telling, the same story.
You and the others must come forward as witnesses when retribution comes. It reminds me of how the Nazis murdered the disabled by gassing them. Our current Nazis’ method is slower, but just as sure.
“Death by a thousand cuts”
There will be no retribution unless there is vocal and plentiful opposition. Currently I don’t see it. It’s a friendly p[lace being here but it isn’t proportionate. Sturgeon has videos of kids thanking her for saving their lives. Most people are brainwashed and are lost to any cause. Which is the point I think.
I think there’s always a difficult trade off to be made with the health of elderly parents and this applies in non covid times too. Basically, are we just shielding them from risk just to give them a few more joyless months of life. In the case of my very frail Dad, he loved seeing my kids, but often enough he would miss seeing them for fear of being laid low by the bugs they were carrying. Now I think he just should have seen them anyway, coldly put, the benefits outweighed the risks. Or put another way, if you’re so decrepit that you’re likely to die anyway, why not enjoy the time you’ve got?
It feels like this point is a duration tipping point. A few middle aged friends are finding things more difficult as of about a week ago.
Somebody needs to make it very personal.
Disturbing echoes of life on the Costa Blanca here on the north coast of Kent. A friend had supper at a formerly excellent local gastro pub recently. Food served on paper plates, drink in plastic beakers, coffee in cardboard cups and names and phone numbers demanded. So an attempt to escape the insanity for a few hours proved anything but. Yet ‘spoons and the local (non-chain) Italian restaurant have provided food, drink and a welcome at least as good as in the past. Let’s hope that the panicking gastro pub comes to its senses before it’s too late.
Well clearly, keeping well away from the gastro is the order of the day.
Giving personal details is voluntary. Its tyere on uk gov website covid advice to hospitality
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/maintaining-records-of-staff-customers-and-visitors-to-support-nhs-test-and-trace#how-records-should-be-maintained
Apologies if you know already, good to keep this circulating.
Reposting, as it was posted just before change over:
Hello All,
Firstly, thank you so much for all the kind words last night. It’s been very encouraging having you here. (And another thank you to Toby for creating this space for us).
Meeting in person has been proposed, and I am volunteering myself to do some organising… we’re on the road at the moment and could do several locations, but also, because my identity online is very easy to check out, and I think – rightfully so – people may have hesitation about sharing identifiable info. If you google TyLean…. you will find me. (I may have dropped in the search engines having lost interest in the social media game).
Please email tylean at tylean dot com. if you want to meet in real time – let me know the geographical area you’re happy to travel and rough dates/times you can meet. Also you can email if you are happy to host and/or have suggestions for a good venue.
So far, somewhere in England near the Welsh Gulag border is looking a promising location, but can revise as I get a better idea of who’s in.
Thank you!
That’s brilliant, TyLean, you’re a star.
As soon as Gulag Wales acknowledges the existence of Other People, I’m on.
I’d be happy to do a meet up as well. Lockdown Sceptics unite!
I’d be happy to meet up with fellow lockdown sceptic. I live in Yarm on Teesside.
I’m in London.
nope – top of the google search page … interesting web site .. interesting artwork!
Thank you!
Sounds like an interesting idea 🙂 I may have to organise my escape from the East Midlands open prison though …
Loughborough here.. ready & waiting
Swadlincote here. Happy to support and help!
Tunnel john.. that would be the inspiration the community needs a tunnel from Liecester to the Welsh Marches, unless you can pull a Colditz and build a glider in your attic. Come to think, arriving in a pommel horse might be the way..
We do have a tunnel in Leicester out from lock down zone. Used to train coal here from coalville way. Any way I prefer the option I took Friday night. Drive out of here for a night at a mates in West bridgford. Any police stopping me would have been told where to go…
Humanity always finds a way!
Thanks for the responses everyone! I have had some emails as well from people keen to meet but who don’t comment. I actually “watched” without commenting for many weeks, so that’s good news…. there are a more people with us than we realise!
I’ll give it to tomorrow morning before I work out logistics to see if anyone else pops up interested. Plus…. it’s been an insane 24 hours, and my brain is fried, lol.
Really looking forward to meeting you all!
Devon
I’d be happy to do a meet as well. I live on the Pest side of Windsor. Please forgive me if I wear a mask while moving around London – it’s for protection from facial recognition software.
Great idea! Buckinghamshire/northants borders.
Sounds a grest idea…i’m down bristol way but happy to travel…
I have a very nifty badge on a lanyard stating I’m except from wearing a mask. Who’d have thought it would be this easy? The lanyard is wide and orange and has “MASK EXCEPT” printed on it in a repeated pattern. The badge is solid plastic and slots into one of those holders people in offices put their passes in. Wore it yesterday in a supermarket. I was the only person, bar a sprightly looking elderly woman, who wasn’t wearing a mask. The shop was very busy. I did get a few eyeballs from afar, but on the most part, everyone ignored me like they were ignoring everyone else. This “don’t look people in the face” thing is new, right? The girl on the checkout looked absolutely broken and kept adjusting her mask while handling people’s purchases… I also had to pop into a local small supermarket today and dropped the lanyard over my head before going inside. The shop had a sign on the door referring to the Scottish Government’s “guidelines” – not laws – on face coverings being required.` Again, no one paid me any heed, including the two members of staff standing near the entrance, both wearing… Read more »
Hi Mark. Are you able to say where you got your badge and lanyard? If possible I’d like to get one. Many thanks.
You can find them on eBay.
Just ordered 2. Best to be prepared! I was just going to carry one of my husbands spare inhalers and pretend to be asthmatic but this is even better.
I have mind in car, ready to go whenever I need it.
My oldest told me that he wandered into a shop on Friday evening to pick up beers, didn’t wear a mask, no one said a thing.
Just like Face from the A-Team (what an apt name). Act like you’re everything you do is legitimate and people won’t question you.
Right there with you Tony – since last night I’ve been contemplating some kind of drastic hunger strike rather than be forced to shop for basic goods with a muzzle/nappy on. Such is the inhumanity of it all.
So Boris wants to muzzle every customer in England, no doubt to reassure the bedwetting contingent that voilà – this magic piece of material over one’s mouth and nose stops the virus dead in its tracks, and now we can all safely spend some of that lovely money in pubs, hairdressers and eateries in order to boost the ailing economy. An economy whose throat this reckless government is determined to keep its boot firmly planted on. Anyway, here’s a solution to kick-start the economy, Boris. It costs you nothing. It won’t take away any more of our precious freedoms. It doesn’t come in the form of a syringe, which may disappoint the Bill Gates’ of this world. Call a press conference. Gather the nation around their TVs. Invite all of the corrupt mainstream media to attend. And you come clean. Come clean about every last bit of it. The dodgy models, the decision to go into lockdown, the utter failure to lift restrictions when it was abundantly clear the virus was receding, the colossal failure to protect nursing homes, the heinous waste of taxpayer’s money that is test and trace, the cruel deprivation of an education for millions of our… Read more »
Hear, hear, excellent! This is what I wrote to my MP on 23 May.
‘If HMG could admit that it has made a terrible error people could in time forgive it and accept that its catastrophic decisions were made with good intentions although based on what turned out to be bad advice.
If HMG cannot admit this it will be unforgivable.’
Not in living memory. That’s only about sixty years. How about worst Prime Minister since before Walpole?
Like, worst ever!
To think we thought Theresa May was bad..
Excellent post.
Hear, hear. He can still salvage his reputation with a mea culpa but I seriously doubt that he will admit that he’s made a mistake. I can imagine him holding on to dear life until he’s stabbed at the back by his fellow MPs who finally have had enough.
Or if our citizenry reenact the 1848 revolution and forcibly remove him from No 10.
If the 1922 Committee were really to think long term, they would start to move against Boris. At present he is just about holding the reins. In a few weeks time when the scale of economic devastation becomes more apparent, the mood of the nation could get very ugly indeed. What then?
Perhaps, aware that the Conservative Party will be unelectable for twenty years, they prefer to hang on and take their chance. But they could consider their duty to the country and start a process from which some of them might emerge with honour.
One hopes and I can imagine that the mood among the 1922 committee is turning ugly. However I suspect they are biding their time, after all he who wields the knife will never inherit the crown.
Mr Bart and I have been talking about the possibility of rioting and where it can start. I believe that it can start anywhere but if it was in London, the shops along Oxford and Regent Streets should start playing nice with customers because they can be the targets for possible revenge when the mood turns really ugly.
There will be some discussion going on, you may be sure…
When Boris was in hospital, they were planning to replace him with Jeremy Hunt or Sajid Javid, according to Mason Mills..
I don’t think that there is an honorable politician alive in the country at present, no matter which colour or hue. And they know that. No matter which way we vote, we’ll get sh*te and they know that. There’s not a piece of bog roll between them. They should be ashamed, but they never ever will. We, the electorate, are just a mild irritation to there corrupt, free loading lifestyles. We have no chance
Simon Dolan said he’d pay for anyone willing to stand up as an Independent at local elections. Anyone interested?
Duty, honour, this lot????????
Over a million people filled the streets in 2002 to protest invading Iraq. It has been eerily quiet ever since. How about some good old bloody mindedness folks? Put on masks, flood the streets of London and then toss those masks in the air in unison in front of #10 and the House of Parliament. I’m rooting for all of you.
Well done. The truth clearly expressed. It does help to know that there are honest clear thinkers out there.
It’s good to read thoughts like yours Scotty87.
Thank you, Basics. I find it difficult to contribute to this forum as much as I’d like due to having 3 kids under 5 including a nearly week-old daughter!
I mostly just have my rant and leave it at that, but I do very much enjoy browsing the glut of fantastic content always guaranteed in the comments section here.
Keep writing for your children’s sake! When they grow up they’ll be able to boast that their mum (hope I’m not misconstruing situation!) was one of the voices of the Great Liberation.
Haha I’m a proud dad Annie but thank you for your kind words. If I can post just a mere fraction of the quality you have added to this forum over the last few months, I will certainly call that a success!
Congratulations to your wife and yourself on the birth of your latest baby!
Thank you kindly, Tim. Scary time to be bringing kids into the world, but it gives you a burning desire to fight this madness which is further crippling our society with each passing day.
Boris could be taking a massive bung from Scamazon.
That should be printed on a million flyers and distributed nationwide!
Wonderful post. For me, the smallest salve of comfort in these ruinous times will be if Johnson finally gets his reckoning and suffers the legacy of being the worst PM in history, after wanting the job for so long and even having the opportunity to rise above the madness and cement his status as a Churchillian leader (original herd immunity strategy). He has blown that opportunity.
Thank you, Poppy. You are exactly right – and to think how much he would be revered by huge sections of society if he had chosen the herd immunity option!
Deaths due to lockdown would be non-existent, domestic abuse and child abuse wouldn’t have horrifically spiked, the mental health of the nation would have been largely preserved, the economy would be in a far better state than we currently find it…the list goes on.
Johnson is a coward who doesn’t believe in very much. This crisis of his own making has ruthlessly exposed his incompatibility with high office.
A coward like the cowardly lion in the Wizard of Oz.
Spot on, Scotty! I won’t forgive or forget his loathsome, damaging, cowardly actions.
Excellent analysis. I agree Bottler Johnson is the worst PM in living memory; I didn’t think Bliar could be surpassed in that regard, save, perhaps, by Komrade Corbynov. Well, we dodged a bullet only to be kiboshed by a mortar. At this point I feel a political orphan so I send a heartfelt plea to Nigel Farage to get the Reform Party up and running ASAP. There must be plenty of his former BP colleagues (rational actors every one) who could play a useful part.
Only one point where I disagree:
I fear that won’t happen. We’re in a situation like that described by James Thurber in his account of ‘The Day The Dam Broke’ – we have a populace that largely believed the lie, and went along with the mass hysteria. They will not easily admit their error, their stupidity, their culpability. And so the lie of Covid-19 will persist for many years because it affords greater psychological comfort than admitting they were fools.
An excellent post! If only Boris had the courage to do it, I think there would be an awful lot of people who might be prepared to forgive (if they wouldn’t forget) the last three months. We can but live in hope…
Theresa May signing us up to net zero made her the worst PM ever.
Then in December, Boris could have thrown that out. He didn’t so that instantly made him as bad as May.
But now he has gone a step further with this lockdown.
So if this was a game of “Top Trumps British Prime Ministers” Boris Johnson would definitely be the card that would make your heart sink when you drew it.
If Tony is reading, Courage mon ami!
Chin up, Tony. It is always darkest before the dawn.
Hey Tony, don’t worry – the fact that you have been worried just means you are a human being with some self respect.
Just say you’re exempt. Lying is very easy when the people you are talking to don’t deserve the truth. Say you are vulnerable to hypercapnia (which we all are of course). Or say you’re not a deviant into public bondage.
The law gives exemption if wearing a mask causes severe distress. No need to explain, though, just plead exemption.
Yes Tony, take heart from all the lovely people here. We all have so much sadness but together we will help each other. Keep your chin up Tony we need you
Carry this around on your device (if you have one) before it gets taken down
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bQo79HRUksk&feature=youtu.be
This video was very good.
Perhaps we should invest in these Oxygen monitors and go out in force and offer to monitor muzzled people’s oxygen levels – they may start to get it then.
Could also buy the finger ones.
There was a great video of an American women who had gone for a post covid check up and been forced to wear a mask who’s oxygen reading was about 90/ The Doctor said to take off the mask and sit for 5 minutes before testing again. It went up to 99. Boy was she mad!
Thanks Everyone,
But I will wait to see what BS our beloved leader brings in on Monday – if it’s just shops then I just won’t go in any!!
But if it’s everywhere – then I know there is no way out of this – the legislation is in place for a minimum of 2 years (and he won’t let that go) and the population is now brainwashed into this – so masks will be here to stay
Ironic that he said only days ago that kids won’t have to wear them when they go back to school.
This dystopian new normal is not worth living in, and there just aren’t enough of us to over turn things.
Just don’t wear one, the law caters for your severe distress. The Nazis back down when challenged. Totally unenforceable if mandatory outdoors, so don’t worry about that. Just avoid Spain, and you’ll be OK.
Don’t let the buggers win, Tony! Every positive thought you have is a poke in their nasty little piggy eyes.
It,s really, really time we started meeting up. Tiny needs sane people and so do we all.
Hang in there Tony, please. Possible plans afoot to fight back big time and I don’t mean riots.
Hoe exactly could Jezzer have been a worse PM than BoJo the Clown?:
At this point, I’m starting to wonder that myself.
Jezzer would have brought in the red army by now
Pre-op rules are keeping people from vital surgery, warns senior doctor
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/07/11/patients-postponing-elective-surgery-draconian-pre-op-coronavirus/
Under NHS England guidelines any elective patient due to have those operations should only be admitted to hospital if they remain asymptomatic having “isolated for 14 days prior to admission along with members of their household”. Even then, they should have a “pre-admission test” to double check that they do not have Covid-19.
This is absolute fucking madness. Anyone thinking this is justified needs locking up – not for crimes, for insanity. (And then for crimes once they get out!)
Yes this is correct. Medical friends are telling me they have extended times of nothing to do because people don’t want to self isolate for 14 days or are afraid to go anywhere near a hospital in fear of catching the terrible virus. Very very poor.
My husband had been having a few stomach issues back in March and was due to have a private procedure (camera down throat) on 1st April to rule out cancer. This was cancelled and the hospital phoned yesterday – earliest appointment 5th August and whole family to self isolate for 14 days beforehand. We have 3 teenagers – no chance are they staying in. Fortunately all symptoms have cleared up which is lucky as a 4 month delay on a diagnosis could be life changing. Wondering if I can get a refund from Bupa for my lack of medical cover during all this!
Just lie to them. They deserve no better.
Looks like they’ve run out of Old People to cull and now need to start on the Ill People. Delaying cancer operations is a good start on that goal.
And if they die in the interim, who bloody cares, eh?
If mask-wearing in shops becomes mandatory, I shall do all my shopping online. Mask wearing (as in cloth masks often touched) is unhygienic, impedes communication, impedes vision thru steamed specs, is hot and unpleasant, and perpetuates fear. As well as being unnecessary. I’m astounded any conservative govt would even contemplate it.
Already I’m gravitating to Tesco who have relaxed somewhat, and for pubs where phone numbers are not taken. The best thing the govt could do is say: “Right, as you were,” and let everything open and anyone attend.
If so, those who are vulnerable or anxious (or fearstruck through repeated propaganda) would not go anywhere; understandable. But everyone else would (swiftly boosting business and revenue). After a few weeks of no increase in covid deaths it would become apparent the risk is negligible – as in well below a bog-standard annual flu-season, and thus reassured everyone could get back to normal.
We need normality. Not just for our personal well-being, but for human contact with families & friends, care of our vulnerable,, schools, leisure, cancer care/screening, normal health service, normal courts/legal processes, and normal work, enterprise, investment, optimism, happiness.
Keep it up Toby.
We’re taking action against the government over face covering.
Please help if you are in the media/PR business.
We need to use this to at least shift public opinion.
Look at the latest post. More information coming regularly. Thanks
Good luck.
Thanks
All the best!
Thanks
Can only offer cash when required as have no relevant expertise, but go it!!!
Have shared onwards.
Mr Bart and I went to Central London today as a very popular place for afternoon tea was doing an offer so we booked a table to have a long delayed joint birthday celebration. The following were our observations: social distancing points dotted about but people ignoring them as store didn’t have many customers one way systems also ignored there were hand sanitizers on various parts of the shop but customers were not forced to use them staff mostly muzzled, it was fairly hard to have a conversation with them but bless them they tried and they kept up with their good customer service no change in their restaurant layout – it was fairly civilised and mostly normal save for the muzzled staff Walking down Piccadilly and Regent Street, it wasn’t as dead as it was a few weeks ago but still not that many people and barely anyone going inside the shops. Walked past Waterstones, Hatchards, Gap, L’Occitane and a few more big name stores and they were pretty devoid of customers. Even the Royal Academy wasn’t exactly heaving unlike last January when we went to see the Picasso exhibition. If Boris thinks that mandatory muzzles will get more… Read more »
The thing most likely to get people out and about is seeing other people out and about in as normal fashion as possible.
Exactly. There was more of the normal behavior along the Soutbank – no antisocial distancing and hardly any muzzles.A few food trucks have set up shop and Westminster council even provided portaloos for people to use.
This is a decent rebuttal against face mask wearing if you’re healthy:
https://twitter.com/angiebUK/status/1281973694575910923
Don’t know how to link multiple images so have posted the most pertinant one for those who don’t have a Twitter account.
It also made me think. The argument for masks is that they may help in case you’re infected. But they definitely do not help if you’re healthy and can in fact be detrimental to health.
I remember an eminent doctor who used the analogy of face mask usage by healthy people as like building a chain link fence to stop mosquitoes
I think the point is if you’re healthy the mask isn’t protecting anybody and it’s actually bad for your health.
Exactly. It’s very much an immunity suppressant and impedes proper breathing. No wonder people I’ve seen wearing them constantly touch their face because they’re struggling to breathe and probably already have too much CO2 in their systems.
My phone decided to go for a burton this morning, so rushed into town this afternoon to the O2 shop. I have recurrent problems with my hearing, which have flared up again recently. I swear to God, she had to repeat everything to me 2 or 3 times behind her face nappy. Really was hard work making out what she said. Would have just left, but I needed a phone, and it would have been the same anywhere else. Would love to have told her to just take her stupid mask off because it muffled her voice, but it wasn’t her fault — she looked as pissed off to be wearing it as I would be.
Witnessed a similar incident today as well, waiter who was muzzled had to repeat what he said 2-3 times to a customer who was hearing impaired. Felt sorry for both as it was clear that the waiter was pissed off with having to wear a muzzle and customer apologetic at having to ask him to repeat to her what he’s just said.
I see this as one fatal reason why the mask is doomed. Even the most hystercally scared won’t endure repeating everything. One lady on the street today in full face visor and mask asked me for directions. Simply could not hear a word. She’ll reflect in time how fast she was to pull the mask down to get her words heard.
I do have a bit of a hearing problem but if I come across anyone in a mask I have to talk to I just tell them very loudly I can’t hear them and could they remove their mask. Everyone so far has complied. Some happily so.
I’m no expert but… so could compulsory mask wearing cause a spike in cases?
Let’s keep an eye on Scotland…
How?
People wearing masks repeatedly will be reducing their immune system function and also breathing back in any viruses they would otherwise have expelled through breathing freely..
I don’t think either of those things would cause a spike but both are genuine concerns.
If everyone wore masks all the time (and that reduced transmission) it would reduce immunity and matters might then be worse (from other viruses) when everyone took their masks off at some point in the future, presumably after having been vaccinated for Covid but not for anything else.
Breathing your own virus back in is a concern because it might give an already infected person a lung infection when previously they just had a basic cold (upper respiratory tract) but it wouldn’t increase the total number of people infected (although some of them might test positive for longer and that might be interpreted as a spike).
No masks guy.
That may be so, but that won’t cause a spike in cases of a virus that barely even exists in Scotland.
Might cause a spike in chest infections though.
The Scottish crest has fallen! What a sublime and unintended put down to all the macmask wearers! So true John!
Thank you. My mother is a Scotswoman.
I don’t think anything much will cause a spike anywhere in the UK (apart from small and unimportant fluctuations) as it looks like we’re basically at herd immunity.
Could masks cause a spike in a place that had very low immunity? Possibly yes if the confidence they gave people exceeded their actual ability to limit spread.
Could possibly get face masks tested for germs to see what they come back with?
Greetings from a new convert..For a while I was a neutral but I’m a data nerd and comparing Sweden and Norway’s infection curves on the John Hopkins site and realising they were exactly the same took me here.
One related issue to get the ball rolling. Why, when NHS figures for Covid 19 deaths are down to 20 or 30 daily do we get daily figures averaging three times that number? Per the ONS, care home deaths are pretty limited nowadays, so they can’t be the source and there is no audit trail or any further details from PHE. I can only suppose that these are individuals who tested positive but were either unaffected or too ill with other complaints to be worth treating. Either way they shouldn’t be in there. I rather fear that Government and Civil Service statistical incompetence is placing a serious millstone around its – and our – necks.
I think that sometimes the reporting of the deaths is delayed by several weeks.
If you’re asking about death figures the numbers most people see, on Worldometer for example, are reported deaths. These are deaths that happened sometime in the past dating back weeks.
The graph for the actual day people died looks very different and there is a lag between when the deaths reported are reconciled with when they happened.
Thanks!
Just want to say welcome to the site 🙂 !
Seconded! Always pleased to meet a new recruit!
Welcome to the club! The more the merrier!
The ruling against Simon Dolan in court seems a likely contributing factor in Johnson’s announcement on masks. I can’t imagine it would have happened if the decision had gone the other way.
I’m wondering if the two cases being brought regarding the closure of churches have also contributed to the mask decision – whether churches will now be told they can re-open, if people wear masks.
The case being brought by Christian Concern will be of particular sensitivity for the government, as they are invoking our Magna Carta rights – I somehow don’t think the government will be wanting the subject of our constitutional rights discussed!
If the churches are re-opened before the case reaches court, the judge will just be able to say a judicial review is unnecessary because churches are no longer shut..
I hope Christian Concern do not accept the wearing of masks as a pre-condition of opening of churches, which would seem to me to defy common sense. But yes, this may well be the government’s thinking – which does not say a lot for the government’s thinking. I am supporting the case brought by Christian Concern, and would personally not be happy about having to wear a mask.
My local Catholic Church (which I attend) started holding daily services with Holy Communion last Sunday – no masks required.
Thank you for the info – I shall check locally.
How utterly wonderful!
Our Anglican and free churches are still tightly shut ( can’t open because of the impossible ‘precautions’), but the Catholic church us now open for private prayer and they welcome all comers. Bless them! If they re-start services I’ll be there. I don’t accept all their doctrine, but God is in their brave and generous hearts.
the CofE won’t do anything ’til the local imam approves it.
I long to be able to snortingly dismiss your comment.
But it’s just too plausible!
Write to them to ask them not to agree to that, they need to consider all side.
I don’t go to church so can’t honestly say I’d go otherwise I’d email them myself.
It would be ridiculous anyway around me as the two churches near me are large and have few parishioners so there’d be no problem with social distancing.