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by Will Jones
15 January 2021 5:04 AM

Steve Baker Demands Boris Publish a Freedom Plan

Steve Baker said the PM's leadership was under threat

Steve Baker, the Deputy Chair of the anti-lockdown Covid Recovery Group (CRG) of Conservative MPs, has issued a rallying cry to the group’s members. The Sun has the story.

In an explosive rallying call to fellow members of the lockdown-sceptic Covid Recovery Group, the ex-minister blasted: “People are telling me they are losing faith in our Conservative Party leadership.”

The group represents dozens of Tory backbenchers who are worried about the side effects of long lockdowns.

Mr Baker urged those colleagues to make their concerns directly to Mr Johnson’s Commons enforcer, Chief Whip Mark Spencer.

In a bombshell note to MPs seen by the Sun, Mr Baker writes: “I am sorry to have to say this again and as bluntly as this: it is imperative you equip the Chief Whip today with your opinion that debate will become about the PM’s leadership if the Government does not set out a clear plan for when our full freedoms will be restored.”

He told them to demand “a guarantee that this strategy will not be used again next winter”.

The major intervention reads: “Government has adopted a strategy devoid of any commitment to liberty without any clarification about when our most basic freedoms will be restored and with no guarantee that they will never be taken away again.”

The action appears to have been triggered by key Government advisers going public with their view that lockdowns must continue well into 2021.

Mr Baker broke cover after Government scientist Jonathan Van Tam told this newspaper yesterday that lockdown measures could be in force until late spring.

And today controversial scientist Neil Ferguson said we could still be facing restrictions in the autumn.

Mr Baker raged: “Certain Government scientists have said that the current lockdown could last until late spring. There is no reason to think there will be any real resistance in Cabinet to the argument for greater and longer and more draconian restrictions on the public.

“This could be a disaster. Nothing seems more certain to break the public than giving hope before taking it away, and doing it repeatedly.”

And he signs off with a barely concealed warning shot: “I am sorry to be blunt but if we do not act now, events will become inevitable. For the good of the country please contact the Chief Whip.”

Katy Balls in the Spectator notes that Baker has diluted the implied threat to Johnson since the story broke. She thinks the intervention is more of a warning shot at this point than a full-blown threat.

Since the comments came to light, he has also tried to water down his comments – insisting Johnson still remains the only man for the job.

So, is Johnson’s leadership under threat? No. That seems premature. The third lockdown was overwhelmingly passed by MPs – with a comparatively small Tory rebellion compared to previous votes. The number of MPs willing to oppose the government on its lockdown strategy has in the short-term decreased. With the death toll on Wednesday alone at over 1,500, many lockdown sceptics plan to keep their powder dry for the time being. Rather than oppose immediate lockdown measures, they are turning their attention to the debate on how many need to be vaccinated before restrictions can be lifted.

Here Baker’s concerns are a sign of things to come. While the bulk of Tory MPs support the government’s approach for now – and are relieved there is finally a good news story to tell in the vaccination programme – the bulk are keen for restrictions to be lifted as soon as possible. Boris Johnson insists this is his wish too. 

However, MPs worry that Johnson will be pushed by his scientific advisers and some cabinet ministers to keep restrictions in place for much longer than they believe is reasonable. In the parliamentary party, many see the point by which the vulnerable have been vaccinated as when restrictions go. They see spring as the point when many restrictions ought to be lifted and the summer the point by which there ought to be no restrictions in place. So far, Johnson has been reluctant to give a specific timeline. That position is going to become much harder to maintain as the weeks go on and discontent grows. 

Stop Press: Sherelle Jacobs has a thoughtful piece in the Telegraph, arguing that there’s going to be a lot of moral and emotional pressure to go for Zero Covid over the coming months and lockdown sceptics need to be ready for the battle.

But what the lockdown-sceptics haven’t quite articulated is that, once again, the public has been persuaded into a lockdown based on a delusion. The myth of the first lockdown was that it would only have to last three weeks. The myth of this lockdown is that life can resume in spring. But restrictions are unlikely to be lifted until the summer at the earliest for a simple reason: it is not deaths but media headlines about overwhelmed ICUs that strike fear into the hearts of ministers. A cynic might argue we have just sacrificed half a year of freedom on the NHS altar to save the skin of the Tories. 

Even with the vaccine rollout at full throttle, the risk of an overwhelmed NHS will not abate until the over-50s are vaccinated, ideally by May. Although the over-75s present the greatest mortality risk, Covid patients in intensive care have a median age of just 62, and under a third are aged over 70. So vaccinating those who might die from Covid will not end pressure on the health service. Paradoxically, a big bang reopening of society when the virus is still circulating may increase it. 

But there is a prospect even worse than another six months of lockdown: another year of lockdown in an attempt to eliminate the virus entirely. 

It is not difficult to see how a terrified population that has been fed guff about “defeating” the virus might be swayed by the Zero Covid argument. Particularly once they realise that “learning to live” with the disease once priority groups have been vaccinated still means accepting heightened vulnerability to mutations and Long Covid, with the endemic virus returning each year. It is also not hard to see how the Tories might see Zero Covid as the path of least resistance. Hyperparanoia about being booted out of office for letting the NHS fall over will increase the temptation to stamp out an unpredictable disease. 

Worth reading in full.

A Senior Doctor Writes…

There follows a guest post by the senior doctor who contributes weekly updates on the state of the NHS to Lockdown Sceptics.

Yesterday the NHS Hospital Statistics Website released a large data packet summarising Covid related activity for the preceding month. Once again, Lockdown Sceptics has kindly asked me for an opinion about what we can deduce from the information provided. There is a lot of useful information in this packet – I apologise to readers if some of the following is a bit dense, technical and difficult to follow, but the devil is often buried in the detail – sometimes he is hidden there deliberately.

Before looking at the monthly summary, I will comment on the daily updates. These are less detailed but more up to date than the monthly figures.

Graph 1 shows the daily admission figures from the community for English regions expressed as a three-day moving average to smooth out the curves. It is clear that for the last week, admissions from the community in London, East England and the South East have been falling – very encouraging.

However, there have been recent uptrends in the Midlands and the North West. The falling rate in London and the South East is consistent with the ZOE app data which showed a downtrend in symptomatic people from about December 31st. Readers should note that the current lockdown began on January 6th. By that point admissions had peaked and were already on the downward slope. The effect (if any) of lockdown on hospital admissions will not be observable until at least January 16th. Nevertheless, the reduction in hospital admissions is being reported in the mainstream media as being a consequence of lockdown – I don’t think that view is supported by the evidence.

Next, the overall inpatient situation on Graph 2. Despite falling admissions from the community, the overall number of Covid patients in London remains flat. How can this be? I will explain later with data from the monthly summary packet.

Finally, on the daily figures, the ICU bed occupancy data in Graph 3. This is the graphic of most concern in my opinion. ICU occupancy tends to lag inpatient admission by two to three days – this is the length of time for a patient to become ill enough to require intensive care according to the ICNARC ICU audit. Hence falling admissions do not immediately translate into falling ICU numbers. The angle of slope in London in particular is still on an upward trend. Some of this may be because London Hospitals are soaking up ICU admissions from the South East region, where local hospital capacity has been exceeded. ICU patients tend to stay a long time, so these numbers take a while to subside when the peak is reached. As far as ICU numbers are concerned the peak does not look like it has arrived yet in any English region. In particular the ICU numbers are still on an upward trend.

The monthly data packet contains a lot of information which I will comment on in the next few days. It has been illuminating in shedding light on several questions which were troubling me. I propose to address just two this evening.

Firstly, the issue of discharging Covid patients from Hospital. Discharging elderly patients in winter is an annual problem. Patients who cannot be discharged are unkindly referred to as “bed blockers”. The usual reasons are that they are too frail to be sent home alone if there is no-one to look after them, or not well enough to be accepted back by a care home. This problem is worsened by care homes being reluctant to accept Covid patients in view of what happened in the spring, when large numbers of patients with Covid were discharged into care homes causing several outbreaks of infection. An article in the Financial Times recently highlighted that insurers of care homes were reluctant to cover them for outbreaks of COVID-19 and that this was delaying hospital discharges.

Graph 4 shows the effect that delayed discharge has on total bed occupancy. This is a complicated compound graph with two separate Y axes, so I will explain what it means. First, consider the first part of the X axis Dec 1st to Dec 9th. During this time, the combined daily admissions and hospital Covid diagnoses depicted in the vertical bars was roughly equal to the daily discharges on the blue line (left hand Y axis). Hence the total number of Covid inpatients on the yellow line was roughly stable.

From December 10th onwards, daily admissions started to exceed discharges and this trend has worsened as the graph proceeds through December into January. As a consequence, the total number of inpatients on the yellow line (right hand Y axis) continues to rise. Readers should note that the monthly figures are only presented up to January 6th, so as of this data packet the admissions downturn on January 7th is not yet visible.

This is clearly a major problem. Although admissions may be falling, the total number of inpatients is still rising because of failure to discharge. In London, the Nightingale hospital has reopened for ‘step down’ patients (not ICU patients as in the spring). It remains to be seen how successful that will be, bearing in mind that shortage of staff (not bed capacity) was the rate-limiting problem in the spring. Elsewhere, some imaginative and intelligent steps have been taken such as utilising spare hotel capacity to place convalescent patients – an affordable and practical solution, often used in the United States.

Now here is one devil. We know hospital discharge is always a problem in the winter. It was entirely predictable that this would be an issue in a ‘second surge’ of COVID-19. A predictable risk, with no plan to deal with it. I wonder why there was no plan? And who is taking the responsibility for the lack of one?

Next, I turn to the issue of age stratification of Covid patients. A few days ago, I saw an article on the BBC news by the reporter Hugh Pym. He visited Croydon University Hospital and reported that there were “many more younger patients” affected by Covid in the winter than in the spring. The monthly data packet does contain age stratified figures for hospital admissions. I thought I should examine these.

First, I looked at the data for England as a whole. It is recorded that 37% of the Covid patients admitted from March 20th to April 30th were aged between 18 and 64. Between November 27th and Jan 6th, 39% of patients were in this younger age bracket – a very modest increase and certainly not “many more” younger patients.

The age bracket 18-64 is quite wide and it could be possible that the distribution is skewed to the younger part of that group. Therefore, I looked at the reported death statistics across the spring and the winter up to Jan 1st 2021, which are much more clearly age stratified. Between March and May 2020 there were 45,511 reported deaths from Covid, of which 3,020 were aged between 0 and 59 years (6.64%). In the period November to January 1st, there were 20,370 deaths of which 1,073 were registered as COVID deaths – 5.26%. So, in fact there were proportionally fewer Covid deaths in the younger age group in the winter than in the spring reported up to January 1st.

Bearing in mind that death registration can lag date of death by up to two weeks, I looked at the ICNARC ICU audit data comparing cohorts of patients admitted up to August 31st and after September 1st till January 6th. Age at admission to ICU was actually older in winter than spring: Mean average 60.2 years in the winter, median 62 years, compared to a mean of 57.8 and a median 59 of years in the spring.

How can we explain this discrepancy? There do not appear to be “many more” younger patients suffering from Covid in hospital this winter. In fact, the official figures suggest that there are proportionally fewer very sick younger patients and fewer deaths in this age group than in the spring. If that is correct, why did Hugh Pym report precisely the opposite on the national news?

Perhaps someone from the BBC could contact Lockdown Sceptics to explain what I’m missing in this data? Surely, the lavishly taxpayer funded BBC, with hordes of researchers, fact checkers and expensive journalists, must be more accurate in its interpretation of the data than one private individual with a laptop and an internet connection. Maybe they have access to more up to date information than I can see. I would be most grateful to be shown the errors in my calculations and will be happy to be corrected if I have misinterpreted the figures.

Finally, having looked at the recent past (monthly data summary) and the present (or as close to it as we are permitted to see by the daily figures), I will turn to the future.

The drop off in community symptoms reported on the ZOE app and reflected in the drop in hospital admissions in London, the South East and East of England is certainly welcome. However, it begs the question of why further lockdown restrictions were necessary on January 6th when the community transmission appeared already to have peaked.

On the other hand, the rise in admissions in the Midlands and the North West is of concern. In particular, the rising trend in ICU admissions is worrying. These are likely to continue to rise for several days at least. An issue that may not be obvious to the non-medical reader is that there are substantial differences between the hospital geography of London and the rest of the UK. A densely populated metropolis like London has several large hospitals in close proximity to each other, all with substantial surge capacity to deal with peaks of excessive demand. Mutual support between hospitals is relatively easy to arrange and co-ordinate, so patients can be transferred between hospitals to manage areas of high stress.

Other regions of England are not so fortunate. Even the larger urban areas of the Midlands and Greater Manchester have fewer large hospitals than London. Transfer of patients between hospitals is more problematic. ICU capacity in particular is not rapidly expandable as it is in the capital and surge resilience, particularly in more rural areas, is lower. This could be a serious problem in the coming days. I hope NHS England has a workable plan in place, but I smell sulphur.

What’s Behind the Pressure on Hospitals?

NHS England COVID Pressure Points
From AdapNation

The guys at AdapNation have put together a handy infographic using the information they’ve gathered from NHS insiders and other sources. They explain:

This explains the discordance between the lower-than-normal bed use and ambulance stats vs the NHS alarm bells.

 I had the insightful opportunity to interview an NHS employee involved in the logistics of a busy England hospital today.

 The message was clear – they are insanely busy. It’s a pressure cooker environment beyond the high pressure they experience every winter.

However, the reason is not a single headline. It doesn’t marry with the raw hospital data. And it certainly is not due to an abnormal excess of acute respiratory infections.

Check out the image [above] that summarises the issues NHS Hospitals are currently facing.

This matches the experience and insights we have received directly from Dr. Malcolm Kendrick, Dr, Clare Craig, various anonymous NHS Hospital workers and a couple of GP staff too.

Worth checking out.

Stop Press: Lockdown Sceptics contributor Jonathan Engler has summarised much of the same data in a Twitter thread.

A few weeks ago @ClareCraigPath, @RealJoelSmalley and I wrote a short piece on endemic Covid, and what it might look like.

It seems particularly relevant to current observations.https://t.co/AWThh2ptLk

— Dr Jonathan Engler MB ChB DipPharmMed LLB (@jengleruk) January 14, 2021

Government Quietly Admits PCR False Positive Problem

There has been understandable concern about the plans, leaked to the Telegraph, to discharge care home residents from hospitals again without a negative PCR test. But is this in fact a belated admission from the Government that PCR tests keep on giving positive results long after the patient ceases to be unwell or contagious? From the Telegraph:

Coronavirus hospital patients can be discharged into care homes without being tested under draft Government guidelines leaked to the the Telegraph.

Care providers have said they are “deeply worried” about the latest proposed rules, which advise clinicians to release patients without requiring them to have a test 48 hours before discharge if they have no new virus symptoms and have isolated in hospital.

For the first time, the Government appears to acknowledge that people could test positive for Covid but not be infectious, suggesting “it will be appropriate for them to move directly to a care home from hospital… because we now know they do not pose an infection risk to other residents in a care home”.

It describes this sub-group as “immunocompetent and with no new symptoms” even if they are within 90 days of their initial symptoms or positive test result.

The top-rated comment under the Telegraph article, from Stephen Jackson, spotted the significance:

The story is misleading.

The real reason for this policy is that PCR tests will continue returning a positive result for several weeks after a person has recovered from Covid and is no longer infectious. This is because PCR analysis will trigger a positive result even if tiny fragments of dead virus are still present/shedding in the nose or throat. If you have a policy of not discharging patients until they’ve tested negative it traps perfectly well and non-infectious people in hospital for weeks on end. This was well documented in South Korea in April-May.

The NHS has to free up beds without risking a care home debacle but I suspect nobody in the health profession wants to admit that PCR tests give so many false positives. That would obviously undermine public confidence in Covid test results and compliance with self-isolation orders. So they’ve had to come up with an alternative policy involving a two-week isolation period before being discharged and perhaps with a deliberate but hushed-up decision not to re-test the patient at that point (knowing it might give a false positive, trapping the patient in hospital again). 

PHE Study Confirms Infection Gives Immunity

A new study from Public Health England has confirmed that infection with SARS-CoV-2 confers strong immunity to the virus. The Times has the details.

The PHE findings are the result of the most comprehensive study into reinfection rates so far. Previous illness provided about 85% protection against both asymptomatic and symptomatic reinfection, researchers said after following thousands of people who caught the virus in the spring.

Although they found that a small number among the group did get infected twice, typically they suffered a milder form of the disease.

With an estimated one in five having been infected, the findings, based on a study of 21,000 UK healthcare workers, suggested that herd immunity could already be slowing the course of the pandemic. However, scientists warned that they still did not know how long immunity lasted.

“What that’s saying to us is that prior infection looks as good as the vaccine, at least at this time interval, which is very good news for the population,” said Susan Hopkins, Deputy Director of the National Infections Service at PHE. “It will help alongside the vaccine to give a level of immunity and protection that will start to reduce transmission.”

The research by PHE followed 6,600 clinical staff infected in the first wave, along with 14,000 who had remained healthy, regularly testing them to see whether they were subsequently positive.

By late November there were 318 infections among the 14,000 and at most 44 reinfections among the 6,600. Most of those cases were mild and showed no symptoms.

There was some uncertainty about the reinfection number, which may have been even lower. The scientists said they could not exclude the possibility that in some cases they were picking up evidence of the first infection.

Although the Pfizer vaccine has a headline efficacy rate of 95%, that figure is based on symptomatic infections alone, so the mildest cases were ignored.

Professor Hopkins said the best way to think of it was that immunity from infection was as good as, or better than, a vaccine.

“The immunity gives you similar effects to the Pfizer vaccine, and much better effects than the AstraZeneca vaccine, and that is reassuring for people,” she said. Two doses of the Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine offer 62% protection.

However, she said it was not a licence to ignore social distancing. “It does seem that new infections can come. You can definitely get reinfected after primary infection,” she said Even in some of those with asymptomatic infections, they found they were shedding a lot of live virus — implying they were infectious without knowing it. But, she, added: “The risk of severe disease is extremely low… even if you are infectious, it is likely to be for a very short period of time.”

“Overall I think this is good news, it allows people to feel that their prior infection will protect them from future infections, but at the same time it is not complete protection and therefore they still need to be careful when they’re out and about,” she added. “I am strongly encouraged that people have immunity that is lasting much more than the few months that was speculated before the summer.”

Frustratingly, PHE has not yet published the study so we cannot look at the details of how infection was diagnosed and what symptoms they had, though the indications in the reports that reinfections were mild or even false positives (picking up fragments from the previous infection) is in line with other evidence to date.

Stop Press: A Lockdown Sceptics reader emailed PHE to ask some questions and find out where the study was published. They quickly got back to him to say: “The paper will be uploaded to a preprint server and made public in the next day or so. You will be able to find a detailed explanation of the methodology there. Apologies for the delay.”

Toby Replies to Neil O’Brien MP

Everyone’s favourite Lockdown Sceptics pin cushion

There follows a guest post by Toby.

Yesterday, I was attacked on Twitter again by the Conservative MP Neil O’Brien – it’s becoming a daily occurrence. This one involved an obsessive degree of offence archaeology. He even listened to last week’s London Calling podcast, carefully noting down any deviations from Covid orthodoxy. Julia Hartley-Brewer had the temerity to ask him why he was trolling people on Twitter instead of looking after his constituents, at which point he immediately started attacking her. All, it seems, to demonstrate his unwavering loyalty to Tory High Command and their forever lockdown policy. As one regular contributor to Lockdown Sceptics observed:

Whatever the era, whatever the epoch, it seems that the Neil O’Brien’s of this world are forever destined to be the first sent into battle. Stolid, inert, expendable; the mediocre soldier, sacrificed in order that the strength of the enemy’s defences might be tested. If he’d have been at Ypres in 1914 you’d have put money on him being the private who’d have been ordered to stick his head up above the trench line just so the commanding officer could get a sense of where the enemy fire was going to come from. He’d have done it eagerly, too, with real patriotic fervour (“How high, Sir! How high!!”).

I decided to respond with a long Twitter thread of my own. For those of you not on Twitter – and who can blame you? – I’ve reproduced it below.

Attacks on Lockdown sceptics – and me in particular – have ratcheted up recently, with one of the most aggressive critics being the Conservative MP @NeilDotObrien. I thought it was time to compose a reply.

On Monday he wrote a piece for @ConHome entitled “Trumpism in Britain. It’s time to call out those in the media who cynically feed the cranks, rioters and conspiracists” in which he compared lockdown sceptics to QAnon conspiracy theorists and anti-vaxxers.

He compared lockdown sceptics to QAnon conspiracy theorists and anti-vaxxers and urged media companies “to practice some basic hygiene about whose views they are promoting”, i.e. no-platform the sceptics.

But arguing that lockdowns cause more harm than they prevent is not comparable to arguing that the US government is run by a cabal of Satan-worshipping paedophiles or that vaccines contain microchips inserted by Bill Gates to control our minds.

In fact, there is a growing body of research showing that quarantining whole populations, the healthy as well as the sick, is a sub-optimal policy response to this pandemic. @AIER published a round up of some of the best here

Yesterday, @the_brumby linked to “30 published papers finding that lockdowns had little or no efficacy (despite unconscionable harms)”

The problem with arguing that lockdown sceptics have “blood on their hands” – an increasingly popular trope – is that it takes it for granted that lockdowns are effective at reducing overall mortality and that is precisely the issue being debated.

This is an important public debate to have, both because it helps us assess the present government’s management of the pandemic and because it will help us prepare better for the next one.

A Conservative MP should not be urging media companies to suppress one side in that debate, particularly as the 2019 Conservative manifesto reaffirmed the party’s commitment to free speech.

In his latest Twitter thread, @NeilDotObrien accuses me of having deleted all my tweets from last year because I’m embarrassed about having got so many things wrong about the virus.

In fact, I installed an app last week that deletes all tweets more than a week old. This was in response to Twitter’s increasing intolerance of people who challenge liberal orthodoxies, including Covid orthodoxy. I would advice other dissenters to do the same.

The app won’t protect you from Twitter’s internal offence archaeologists, but it will make it harder for censorious, left-wing activists to bombard the company with vexatious complaints in the hope of getting you banned. The app is here.

@NeilDotObrien also selectively quoted from various posts I’ve done for the @Telegraph. For instance, he quoted me saying this: “we were told… the number of infected people was on the rise again… the rise was due to a combination of increased testing and false positives.”

Here are the two paragraphs he got that quote from. See what he did there?

Of course, I’ve got some things wrong about the virus, such as predicting there wouldn’t be a resurgence of infections this winter. I put my hands up to that on @Newsnight when @maitlis asked me about it.

But I don’t think lockdown sceptics have been consistently more wrong about the virus than lockdown advocates. For instance, the @WHO initially estimated the IFR of COVID-19 was 3.4%. We now believe it’s ~.25%.

A study by researchers at UCLA and IHME compared the accuracy of various models predicting COVID-19 mortality and the models produced by Imperial were judged to have far higher rates of error than the others — always erring on the side of being too high.

After the government unveiled its “graph of doom” showing deaths could climb to 4,000 a day absent more restrictions, it was reprimanded by the @UKStatsAuth.

And how much trust can you place in the advice of public health authorities to wear masks when the initial advice was that they were ineffective outside healthcare settings?

Yes, lockdown sceptics have got some things wrong, too, but I think we’ve provided an important counterweight to the largely one-sided reporting of the broadcast media, particularly the BBC.

The daily sceptical blog I put together with a team of other, like-minded journalists has published some important stories, such as this one by a Lighthouse Lab whistleblower.

And this one by a disillusioned worker at a pop-up testing facility in Salisbury.

And this review of the code powering Neil Ferguson’s epidemiological model by Mike Hearn, formerly a senior software engineer at @Google.

It’s also published some terrific pieces of writing, such as this piece on conspiracy theories by Sinéad Murphy, a philosophy lecturer at Newcastle.

And this “Postcard From Argentina” by a social science professor.

And this tribute to all those who’ve been laid low by the collateral damage caused by the lockdowns by Freddie Attenborough, a sociology lecturer.

Lockdown Sceptics will continue to publish these dissenting voices and continue to challenge the official narrative being pumped out by the government and the BBC. I don’t think that’s “dangerous”; I think politicians trying to smear and silence dissenting voices is dangerous.

Blaming the high daily death tolls on lockdown sceptics is a variant of blaming the public. If only ordinary people had been more compliant, we wouldn’t be in this pickle. But thanks to lockdown sceptics like @toadmeister, @allisonpearson, @ClarkeMicah, @JuliaHB1 and @LozzaFox…

Nothing to do with the lack of PPE, failure to create dedicated hospitals for Covid patients, spunking tens of billions of pounds on a not-fit-for-purpose Test and Trace programme, building the Nightingales but not recruiting or training enough healthcare workers to staff them…

…decommissioning the Nightingales, failing to eliminate in-hospital infections and the ongoing scandal of secondary transmission in care homes… no. It’s all the fault of the general public and the “conspiracy theorists” who’ve led them astray.

Time to take the mote out of your eye @NeilDotObrien and take a look at the politicians you’re so eager to curry favour with. Lockdown sceptics won’t be your scapegoats. //Ends

Stop Press: Julia H-B did a bit of offence archaeology of her own and discovered that Neil O’Brien wasn’t that keen on lockdown restrictions himself back in July. Fancy that!

https://twitter.com/BellTrend/status/1349820996258291717?s=20

Norway Says Very Frail People Should Not Receive Covid Vaccine: “Side Effects May Have Led to Deaths”

Norwegian Medicines Agency Chief Physician Sigurd Hortemo

Norway has determined that vaccinations may be contributing to deaths in the very frail elderly and changed its advice. Trondheim24 has the story (via Google translate, H/T Alex Berenson).

More than 25,000 Norwegians have been vaccinated with the first dose of the coronary vaccine from Pfizer and Biontech since Christmas. On Friday, the first dose of the new Moderna vaccine will be given.

So far, the Norwegian Medicines Agency has assessed 29 adverse reaction reports after the COVID-19 vaccination. 13 of these had a fatal outcome, shows a new report from the Norwegian Medicines Agency.

A total of 23 deaths have been reported in connection with vaccination, but so far only 13 of these have been assessed. The other deaths are under treatment. Common side effects may have contributed to a serious course in frail elderly people, the Norwegian Medicines Agency reports.

All the deaths have occurred in frail, old patients in nursing homes. All are over 80 years old and some of them over 90, according to NRK.

The reports may indicate that common side effects from mRNA vaccines, such as fever and nausea, may have led to deaths in some frail patients, says chief physician Sigurd Hortemo in the Norwegian Medicines Agency.

As a result, both the National Institute of Public Health and the Norwegian Medicines Agency have changed the corona vaccination guide with new advice for this group.

If you are very frail, you should probably not be vaccinated, said subject director Steinar Madsen in the Norwegian Medicines Agency at a webinar on coronary vaccine for journalists on Thursday.

He emphasises that these cases are rare, and that many thousands of frail people have been vaccinated without a fatal outcome.

This side-effect of possible hastening of death among the very frail is not welcome news when the Government is relying on vaccination to reduce the death toll from the virus, which is concentrated amongst the frail elderly. It will be interesting to see whether any other health agencies come to similar conclusions and their governments follow suit.

Stop Press: Initial data from vaccination frontrunner Israel suggests that the Pfizer vaccine reduces infections by around 50% 14 days after the first shot. The Times of Israel has more.

Initial data from Israel’s vaccination campaign shows that Pfizer’s coronavirus vaccine curbs infections by some 50% 14 days after the first of two shots is administered, a top Health Ministry official said Tuesday, as the country’s serious COVID-19 cases, daily infections and total active cases all reach all-time peaks.

Sharon Alroy-Preis, head of the Health Ministry’s Public Health Department, told Channel 12 News that the data was preliminary, and based on the results of coronavirus tests among both those who’ve received the vaccine and those who haven’t.

Other, somewhat contrary data was released by Israeli health maintenance organizations Tuesday evening. Channel 13 News said that according to figures released by Clalit, Israel’s largest health provider, the chance of a person being infected with the coronavirus dropped by 33% 14 days after they were vaccinated. Separate figures recorded by the Maccabi health provider and aired by Channel 12 showed the vaccine caused a 60% drop in the chances for infection 14 days after taking the first shot.

Each of the HMOs compiled the data from some 400,000 patients they treated (800,000 in total).

The cause for the discrepancy between the studies was not immediately clear.

With Pfizer’s phase 3 trials only checking some 40,000 people, and given Israel’s world-leading vaccination campaign, the data could be some of the best on-the-ground indication yet of the vaccine’s efficacy.

Stop Press 2: The Guardian reports that Pimlico Plumbers, a large London plumbing firm, plans to rewrite all of its workers’ contracts to require them to be vaccinated against coronavirus. There may be legal issues, some lawyers have said.

Can Rogue Covid Police Officers be Sued?

Jessica Allen and Eliza Moore, who were accosted by police and fined £200 for walking five miles from home, have had their penalties cancelled

Our legal eagle, Dr John Fanning, Senior Lecturer in Tort Law at the University of Liverpool, answers a Covid legal question posed by a reader.

The myriad incidents of what might charitably be described as ‘police overreach’ are among the most unedifying spectacles of the COVID-19 crisis. The chief constable who threatened to deploy police officers to search people’s shopping trolleys to check that they were purchasing only ‘essential’ items. The man with a legitimate exemption from the requirement to wear a face mask escorted under threat of arrest out of a supermarket in Oldbury. And most recently, Derbyshire Police’s heavy-handed treatment of Jessica Allen and Eliza Moore as they enjoyed a socially-distanced stroll and a cup of tea. A year ago, these incidents would have been the workings of dystopian fantasy or the conceit of black comedy. No longer, it seems. As Lord Sumption pointed out in a recent lecture, the police have, at various points in this crisis, “substantially exceeded even the vast powers that they have received”.

All this raises questions about police liability when they get things wrong. The problem is that successful claims for negligence depend on there being proof of damage, such as personal injury. In a recent Supreme Court decision, police officers who injured a passer-by while effecting the arrest of a suspect were liable for her injuries. In all of the examples given above, however, the police apologised for overstepping the mark and, where relevant, cancelled any fines issued under the Regulations. So, no harm done – or at least not enough to raise a question of negligence.

The most likely source of civil dispute against the police at present probably lies in the tort of false imprisonment. This entails a complete restriction of a person’s freedom of movement without any legal authorisation. To use the reported details of Ms Allen and Ms Moore’s case as an example (although I do so with caution because I am not privy to all the facts), it is arguable that the seven police officers who surrounded the two friends imposed a constraint on their freedom of movement at least for a short period of time. The question is whether they had legal authorisation to do so. According to paragraph 2 of Part 1 of Schedule 3A to the Health Protection (Coronavirus, Restrictions) (All Tiers) (England) Regulations 2020/1374, a person is permitted to take exercise outside in a public outdoor place with one other person who is not a member of his/her household. By the letter of the law, it seems that Ms Allen and Ms Moore did nothing wrong and the police should have allowed them to continue their walk. 

The reason they did not, it seems, is because the two friends were five miles away from their respective homes (and therefore not “local”) and were each carrying a cup of peppermint tea (and were therefore having a “picnic”). Yet the requirement to “stay local” is mere guidance, not law – it is a product of “legislation-by-press-conference” which has become an enduring theme of this crisis. And the idea that ‘two teas make a picnic’ is worthy of a stage farce. It is true that going for a picnic in the conventional sense does not constitute a “reasonable excuse” to be outside the place where one lives. But there is nothing in the rules which prohibits the consumption of food or drink during the course of legitimate exercise. Presumably, as long as one is doing star jumps at the material time, one can lawfully eat sandwiches, crisps and pork pies in the park while someone who is not a member of the same household swigs lemonade between sit-ups. The problem is that there has been a troubling conflation of legal rules and generalised advice or recommendations in recent weeks which risks undermining the rule of law. Small wonder that police officers, who are not lawyers and must navigate tempestuous legal seas, are struggling at times to delineate the limits of their powers.

A reader of this blog has asked whether a police officer would be personally liable for any harm he/she causes a person to suffer (e.g. through negligence, false imprisonment, and so on) and therefore required to pay damages out of his/her own pocket. In practice, the answer is no: the chief constable of the relevant police force would normally be vicariously liable for the officer’s tortious conduct as his/her “employer”. Vicarious liability is a rule of responsibility by which employers answer and pay for the injury, loss or damage occasioned to third parties by their employees. It is true that the employer can later seek an indemnity from its employee but this rarely happens. The rationale for this is that employers have “deep(er) pockets” – that is, more resources – from which to pay compensation to injured parties. This is not to say that there are no ‘internal’ consequences for individual police officers (such as disciplinary action), nor does it rule out the possibility of prosecution for criminal offences.

Another Lockdown Tragedy

A reader has got in touch to tell us of how lockdown has affected someone they know:

I heard today that my cousin’s 50-something wife – whose chemo for breast cancer was halted during the first lockdown – was reassessed today with a view to starting up the treatment again. They told her that it’s now spread too far and she won’t have long, so there’s no point in restarting the chemo. Still, at least lots of 80-somethings will get a few more years…

What’s more, she felt that she couldn’t tell her mum in person because she didn’t want to get in trouble, so she phoned and I can’t imagine how that call went.

Why is this sort of thing happening? What is the end goal, do you think? Is it about control or to become a communist state? To hit CO2 targets? I just don’t understand how these rules have come to pass that are so ruinous to peoples lives. Why doesn’t anyone listen to what the evidence shows?

Round-up

  • “Regulator refuses to approve mass daily Covid testing at English schools” – Guardian report that the MHRA has refused to green-light the Government’s mass testing programme in schools using Lateral Flow Tests because of the risk from their supposedly high rate of false negatives (in fact mostly based on a misplaced faith in the PCR test)
  • “The truth about the COVID-19 vaccine” – Watch Dr Simone Gold from American Frontline Doctors offer her thoughts on treatments and vaccines for COVID-19
  • “The unpersoning of a lockdown critic” – Jake Welch in Conservative Woman tells the sorry tale of Michael Wendler, a German pop singer who was cancelled when he compared lockdown to a concentration camp
  • “Leaders Need to Harness Aristotle’s Three Types of Knowledge” – Roger L. Martin, Richard Straub, and Julia Kirby in the Harvard Business Review take a philosophical look at what went wrong in 2020
  • “Children and young may be left to catch Covid in future, says PHE head” – Mary Ramsay, PHE’s head of immunisation, comes out as an unlikely focused protection proponent when she tells MPs: “We may need to accept, if the vaccine doesn’t prevent transmission, that we’re going to protect the people who are really vulnerable … but we allow the disease to circulate in younger people where it’s not causing much harm”
  • “My speech during the debate on COVID-19, January 12th 2021” – John Redwood bringing a sceptical voice to Parliament
  • “What Happened to the Mental Health Crisis among Younger People?” – Mental health researcher Dr Niall McCrae in Areo looks at what’s causing poor mental health in young people
  • “Patient ‘safety’ checks are causing deadly vaccination delays” – Peter Furness in the Spectator has seen the immunisation programme from both sides and is exasperated by the excessive safety protocols imposed from the top with no thought as to how to improve throughput
  • “There will never be a ‘normal’ again” – William Parker in Bournbrook fears there may be no going back to a world where we’re not ruled by public health dogma
  • “A Pandemic Reading List for Left, Right, and Libertarians” – Jeffrey A. Tucker on AIER offers some suggestions of books that show how it should have been done
  • “Mass population screening for SARS-CoV-2 and false positives – why Liverpool shows we have a problem” – Letter from Lockdown Sceptics contributor David Cook in the BMJ
  • “Vaccine success is on the brink of transforming the lockdown debate” – Fraser Nelson in the Telegraph with some optimism
  • “Brazilian Covid variant may infect people who have recovered from virus” – Fears over another new variant – this is going to be a recurring theme – but hard data is sparse
  • Brilliant sum-up of the Great Reset here – not that we believe in it, you understand

CLIP FROM LAST YEAR IN THE SPRING OF 2020.THIS AGED VERY VERY WELL pic.twitter.com/p6Y4PaE52t

— ZNeveri (@ZNeveri) January 13, 2021

Theme Tunes Suggested by Readers

Three today: “Freedom come, freedom go” by The Fortunes, “Behind the Mask” by Michael Jackson and “I’m So Tired Of It All” by Merle Haggard.

Love in the Time of Covid

Warren Beatty and Faye Dunaway as Bonnie and Clyde

We have created some Lockdown Sceptics Forums, including a dating forum called “Love in a Covid Climate” that has attracted a bit of attention. We have a team of moderators in place to remove spam and deal with the trolls, but sometimes it takes a little while so please bear with us. You have to register to use the Forums as well as post comments below the line, but that should just be a one-time thing. Any problems, email the Lockdown Sceptics webmaster Ian Rons here.

Sharing Stories

Some of you have asked how to link to particular stories on Lockdown Sceptics so you can share it. To do that, click on the headline of a particular story and a link symbol will appear on the right-hand side of the headline. Click on the link and the URL of your page will switch to the URL of that particular story. You can then copy that URL and either email it to your friends or post it on social media. Please do share the stories.

Social Media Accounts

You can follow Lockdown Sceptics on our social media accounts which are updated throughout the day. To follow us on Facebook, click here; to follow us on Twitter, click here; to follow us on Instagram, click here; to follow us on Parler, click here; and to follow us on MeWe, click here.

Woke Gobbledegook

We’ve decided to create a permanent slot down here for woke gobbledegook. Today, Janice Turner in the Times contemplates what will become of Sex and the City by the time the activists have finished with it.

Last week, listlessly seeking distraction from doom, I found myself watching the first four episodes of Sex and the City back-to-back in a happy trance. Friends meeting for brunch! Cocktail hour, fancy shops, city streets full of purposeful people, frivolous frocks, dinner reservations, the casual exchange of bodily fluids.

SATC was never a feminist road map. It was a consumerist, hedonist fantasy reflecting the prelapsarian Nineties and its creator Darren Star, a gay man. And unlike women, gay men are enviably unapologetic about how they get their kicks.

Moreover, while straight male escapism like Entourage is seldom parsed for racial or heteronormative wrong-think, anything women love, from Lena Dunham’s Girls to Fifty Shades of Grey, must be dissected and diminished: if it does not somehow encompass every female experience it cannot speak for any women at all.

Now the remaining SATC “girls” are worse than rich, white and horny: they are middle-aged. I hope the new show And Just Like That conveys the filthy laughter in older women’s lives. But I fear, given US cultural mores, it would be better named The Three Karens: jokes will be only at their expense and they will be compelled to “check their privilege” as once they checked their coats.

Worth reading in full.

Stop Press: Macaulay Culkin has thrown his support behind calls to have Donald Trump’s cameo edited out of “Home Alone 2”. Inevitably.

“Mask Exempt” Lanyards

We’ve created a one-stop shop down here for people who want to obtain a “Mask Exempt” lanyard/card – because wearing a mask causes them “severe distress”, for instance. You can print out and laminate a fairly standard one for free here and the Government has instructions on how to download an official “Mask Exempt” notice to put on your phone here. And if you feel obliged to wear a mask but want to signal your disapproval of having to do so, you can get a “sexy world” mask with the Swedish flag on it here.

Don’t forget to sign the petition on the UK Government’s petitions website calling for an end to mandatory face masks in shops here.

A reader has started a website that contains some useful guidance about how you can claim legal exemption. Another reader has created an Android app which displays “I am exempt from wearing a face mask” on your phone. Only 99p.

If you’re a shop owner and you want to let your customers know you will not be insisting on face masks or asking them what their reasons for exemption are, you can download a friendly sign to stick in your window here.

And here’s an excellent piece about the ineffectiveness of masks by a Roger W. Koops, who has a doctorate in organic chemistry. See also the Swiss Doctor’s thorough review of the scientific evidence here and Prof Carl Heneghan and Dr Tom Jefferson’s Spectator article about the Danish mask study here.

Stop Press: A Lockdown Sceptics reader found that although Tesco does still allow exemptions in line with Government guidance, someone needs to tell the staff:

On Tuesday I went into our local Tesco Store without a mask as usual and, having completed my shopping and checked out at the self-service till, I was, for the first time ever, challenged by an employee about not wearing a mask. I told him I was exempt, and he then informed me that from that day (January 12th) Tesco would refuse entry to anyone not wearing a mask or a lanyard. In a polite exchange, I informed him that I had a lanyard but there was no legal requirement under the law for me to wear it or for him to ask me why I was exempt. He nevertheless insisted that I would be refused entry in future if I didn’t comply as that was the policy handed down from Head Office.

I emailed Tesco Head Office to clarify the position and received the following response which is contrary to the employee’s understanding:

“Thank you for your email.

“In line with Government guidelines, customers will need to wear a face covering in our stores. However, if a customer advises they are exempt from wearing a face covering, my store colleagues should not challenge you and not ask or imply you should be wearing a lanyard as this is not the guidance that our Head Office has given them.

“Thank you for your time.”

The Great Barrington Declaration

Professor Martin Kulldorff, Professor Sunetra Gupta and Professor Jay Bhattacharya

The Great Barrington Declaration, a petition started by Professor Martin Kulldorff, Professor Sunetra Gupta and Professor Jay Bhattacharya calling for a strategy of “Focused Protection” (protect the elderly and the vulnerable and let everyone else get on with life), was launched in October and the lockdown zealots have been doing their best to discredit it ever since. If you googled it a week after launch, the top hits were three smear pieces from the Guardian, including: “Herd immunity letter signed by fake experts including ‘Dr Johnny Bananas’.” (Freddie Sayers at UnHerd warned us about this the day before it appeared.) On the bright side, Google UK has stopped shadow banning it, so the actual Declaration now tops the search results – and Toby’s Spectator piece about the attempt to suppress it is among the top hits – although discussion of it has been censored by Reddit. The reason the zealots hate it, of course, is that it gives the lie to their claim that “the science” only supports their strategy. These three scientists are every bit as eminent – more eminent – than the pro-lockdown fanatics so expect no let up in the attacks. (Wikipedia has also done a smear job.)

You can find it here. Please sign it. Now over three quarters of a million signatures.

Update: The authors of the GBD have expanded the FAQs to deal with some of the arguments and smears that have been made against their proposal. Worth reading in full.

Update 2: Many of the signatories of the Great Barrington Declaration are involved with new UK anti-lockdown campaign Recovery. Find out more and join here.

Update 3: You can watch Sunetra Gupta set out the case for “Focused Protection” here and Jay Bhattacharya make it here.

Update 4: The three GBD authors plus Prof Carl Heneghan of CEBM have launched a new website collateralglobal.org, “a global repository for research into the collateral effects of the COVID-19 lockdown measures”. Follow Collateral Global on Twitter here. Sign up to the newsletter here.

Judicial Reviews Against the Government

There are now so many legal cases being brought against the Government and its ministers we thought we’d include them all in one place down here.

The Simon Dolan case has now reached the end of the road. The current lead case is the Robin Tilbrook case which challenges whether the Lockdown Regulations are constitutional. You can read about that and contribute here.

Then there’s John’s Campaign which is focused specifically on care homes. Find out more about that here.

There’s the GoodLawProject and Runnymede Trust’s Judicial Review of the Government’s award of lucrative PPE contracts to various private companies. You can find out more about that here and contribute to the crowdfunder here.

And last but not least there was the Free Speech Union‘s challenge to Ofcom over its ‘coronavirus guidance’. A High Court judge refused permission for the FSU’s judicial review on December 9th and the FSU has decided not to appeal the decision because Ofcom has conceded most of the points it was making. Check here for details.

Samaritans

If you are struggling to cope, please call Samaritans for free on 116 123 (UK and ROI), email jo@samaritans.org or visit the Samaritans website to find details of your nearest branch. Samaritans is available round the clock, every single day of the year, providing a safe place for anyone struggling to cope, whoever they are, however they feel, whatever life has done to them.

Shameless Begging Bit

Thanks as always to those of you who made a donation in the past 24 hours to pay for the upkeep of this site. Doing these daily updates is hard work (although we have help from lots of people, mainly in the form of readers sending us stories and links). If you feel like donating, please click here. And if you want to flag up any stories or links we should include in future updates, email us here. (Don’t assume we’ll pick them up in the comments.)

And Finally…

Toby has a great piece in Die Weltwoche about the Big Tech free speech disaster that has unfolded over the last week or so.

Free speech isn’t having a good year. In the UK, we naively thought we’d won a significant victory on January 5th when Google reinstated the YouTube channel of a right-of-centre, anti-lockdown radio station it had banned 12 hours earlier. This was after a chorus of protest by free speech supporters. But any hope that Big Tech would rein itself in was short-lived. 

The riot in Washington, D.C. 24 hours later, when Trump supporters stormed the U.S. Capital, was the excuse that Facebook and Twitter had been waiting for. Within days, the President of the United States had been suspended from both platforms – permanently in the case of Twitter – as had many of his most passionate supporters.

The rationale for this act of censorship was a familiar one. According to Twitter, Trump had posted two messages that could be “mobilized by different audiences… to incite violence”. 

So what had the President said? Had he called on his supporters to storm the Capital building again? Encouraged people to assassinate Joe Biden? No, the tweets which had incited violence were as follows:

“The 75,000,000 great American Patriots who voted for me, AMERICA FIRST, and MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN, will have a GIANT VOICE long into the future. They will not be disrespected or treated unfairly in any way, shape or form!!!”

“To all of those who have asked, I will not be going to the Inauguration on January 20th.”

Not much incitement going on there. No, this was an act of censorship, following a demand issued by hundreds of Twitter employees. A private corporation had decided to silence a man to whom 74 million Americans had given their vote. 

But if you thought liberal-left civil rights defenders in the United States would be up in arms about this, you’d be mistaken. On the contrary, this reversal of the usual banana republic pattern, in which a populist President was “disappeared” by a cabal of left-wing agitators, was largely welcomed by the liberal elite and mainstream media. 

Worth reading in full.

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2K Comments
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Anti_socialist
Anti_socialist
5 years ago

Universal Declaration on Bioethics and Human Rights

Article 6 – Consent

3. In appropriate cases of research carried out on a group of persons or a community, additional agreement of the legal representatives of the group or community concerned may be sought. In no case should a collective community agreement or the consent of a community leader or other authority substitute for an individual’s informed consent.

53
0
Anti_socialist
Anti_socialist
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

I’d call lockdowns experimental medical intervention & I don’t consent!

66
0
karenovirus
karenovirus
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

Neither do I

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0
TJN
TJN
5 years ago
Reply to  karenovirus

Me neither.

0
0
Bart Simpson
Bart Simpson
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

Ditto. I Do Not Consent.

19
0
Burlington
Burlington
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

I do not consent.

15
0
Steven F
Steven F
5 years ago
Reply to  Burlington

I can’t imagine many people on here who do!

2
0
J4mes
J4mes
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

The experimental stages led up to this, and we’re now well and truly into the administration of Agenda 21-30, the Great Reset. Eventually, even those sceptics on here who are still scared of labels will come to terms with this – sooner the better because time is being wasted.

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-1
ShropshireLass
ShropshireLass
5 years ago
Reply to  J4mes

Wholeheartedly agree J4mes. I originally dismissed the WEF’s Great Reset and Fourth Industrial Revolution plans as a conspiracy theory – until I saw a white paper on the government website where it clearly states the UK government has formed a partnership with the WEF. Then I spent more than a day trawling through as much of the content of the WEF website as I could manage. What I found there – in plain sight, was absolutely chilling and I couldn’t believe what is being planned for us all (a lot of which is hidden under what on the surface sounds like laudable and even altruistic reasoning, but beneath that the reality of what many of the plans will actually mean – or lead to in practice is appalling and horrifying – total slavery for 99% of the world’s population.

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JanMasarykMunich
JanMasarykMunich
5 years ago
Reply to  ShropshireLass

Young people need to wake up to this. It is not about ensuring their future (or the planet’s — and I say that as a lifelong committed environmentalist.)

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PastImperfect
PastImperfect
5 years ago
Reply to  JanMasarykMunich

Engage the zombies on social media and fight off the SS (77th brigade). We need to keep hammering away.

Also leaflets, stickers, pamphlets.

Last edited 5 years ago by PastImperfect
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-1
HelenaHancart
HelenaHancart
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

I do not consent either.

6
0
RichardJames
RichardJames
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

I Do Not Consent.

5
0
Crimson Avenger
Crimson Avenger
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

I do not consent.

2
0
Bungle
Bungle
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

I dissent.

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0
Annie
Annie
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

I don’t think there’s much point in invoking human rights conventions. Our most basic human rights, guaranteed in umpteen international and national declarations, conventions, laws etc, have been trampled on for months and no human rights pundit seems to care in the slightest. Nor, of course, do the zombies.

Last edited 5 years ago by Annie
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cloud6
cloud6
5 years ago
Reply to  Annie

Human Rights Act not worth the paper it’s printed on, it has get out of jail cards that make it worthless. The Conservatives have a plan to abolish the present (1997) legislation.

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Nick Rose
Nick Rose
5 years ago
Reply to  cloud6

Human Rights Act is an EU construct, so yes, it needs to go. A more robust use of the Bill of Rights (Petition of Right in Scotland) is required.

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John001
John001
5 years ago
Reply to  Nick Rose

The European Convention of Human Rights was produced by the Council of Europe, a separate body and predating the EEC and the EU. All European countries belong to it. If you look back to find who wrote the ECHR you find names of Tory lawyers, close colleagues of a man called … what’s his name … ah, Churchill.

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Rowan
Rowan
5 years ago
Reply to  Nick Rose

There is no chance of any of the UK governments introducing more robust human rights legislation. You’d be throwing the baby out with the bathwater. We hold on to what we have got, there is no chance of anything better.

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JohnB
JohnB
5 years ago
Reply to  Rowan

… there is no chance of anything better.

Nah. Poor example for our descendants.

As more and more folk return to normal, Gollum will stumble, rumours of Aslan’s return will spread, Gryffindor will win the qidditch cup, Liverpool will retain the Premier League title, and Lucky Jack Aubrey will sail into port with more prizes than you could shake a stick at.

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Anti_socialist
Anti_socialist
5 years ago
Reply to  Annie

WTF! So we should just abandon international law because our current government ignores our human rights, should we?

There’s one reason only why people are currently ignoring human rights violations, the liberal leftists who assert health is a right to overrule all others.

Which is clearly ludicrous because good health isn’t gift anyone can assure or guarantee.

16
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JHUNTZ
JHUNTZ
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

Well it either needs to be heavily amended or replaced as it is currently not fit for purpose.

2
0
Crimson Avenger
Crimson Avenger
5 years ago
Reply to  JHUNTZ

It seems that we can be locked up indefinitely, fined and abused by police for soing orfinary, normal things, but anyone can wander into the country and get four star treatment.

1
0
bebophaircut
bebophaircut
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

Right on! Quebec just imposed another lockdown/curfew a few days ago. No one allowed out and about after 8 P.M. And PM Trudeau is mulling over having another Federal election just 15 months after the last one. They’re going for the kill.

3
0
Van Allen
Van Allen
5 years ago
Reply to  Annie

The zombies don’t care because they have been brainwashed. Surely this is also against human rights?

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0
J4mes
J4mes
5 years ago
Reply to  Van Allen

Exactly. It’s important to remind ourselves routinely that our friends and family have been thoroughly brainwashed through threat of death.

I quit Facebook a few days ago. The last action I took was to report a W.H.O. post about Covid19 as terrorism.

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Nick Rose
Nick Rose
5 years ago
Reply to  Annie

We’ll be invoking human rights conventions when the Corona Trials are underway!

8
0
bebophaircut
bebophaircut
5 years ago
Reply to  Annie

If you read the U.N.’s Declaration on Human Rights you will notice that it is, on the whole, vague, wishwashy and subject to interpretations that could go either way.

2
0
Nick Rose
Nick Rose
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

I do not consent to ANY non-pharmaceutical intervention and will view evidence before deciding on any pharmaceutical remedies.

8
0
Jinks
Jinks
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

The sleight of hand is wicked. It is NOT a vaccine, it’s a biologic agent given approval for experimental use, akin to being offered an experimental cancer treatment, when severely ill. And people are NOT being informed of this very simple fact. Hence the exemption from liability for the pharmaceutical companies

26
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Rowan
Rowan
5 years ago
Reply to  Jinks

It is actually more like being given an experimental cancer drug, when you don’t have cancer.

19
0
Luckyharry69
Luckyharry69
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

I’m not a happy bunny

4
0
Rowan
Rowan
5 years ago
Reply to  Luckyharry69

No reason to be.

1
0
CivilianNotCovidian
CivilianNotCovidian
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

I do not consent

3
0
OKUK
OKUK
5 years ago
Reply to  CivilianNotCovidian

That’s a good banner line for our first mass protest: I DO NOT CONSENT.

1
0
ShropshireLass
ShropshireLass
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

Do you have a link to the actual document, please?

1
0
Paddy
Paddy
5 years ago
Reply to  ShropshireLass

It’s available at UNESCO.org
under the title, “Universal Declaration on Bioethics and Human Rights”: 19 October 2005

http://portal.unesco.org/en/ev.php-URL_ID=31058&URL_DO=DO_TOPIC&URL_SECTION=201.html

2
0
nottingham69
nottingham69
5 years ago

It might help if the odd journalist started reporting the truth. 1538 deaths on Wednesday is a lie. This is the scam that allowed this rancid government to carry this shit through the summer and lead to what we have now.

There is no reason why Bunter can’t start lifting some restrictions on Feb 1st in rural areas as the seasonal peak fades weeks into the past. Ring Ron DeSANCTIS in Florida not wannabee celebrity Van Tam to see how it is done.

54
0
Mr Taxpayer
Mr Taxpayer
5 years ago
Reply to  nottingham69

There were 1600 deaths per day in UK in 2019. If there are 1,500 covid deaths, does that mean 3,000+ total. If that were the case, why is my local priest not conducting twice as many funerals? Anybody work in the funeral industry and able to say if trade has doubled???

19
0
Rowan
Rowan
5 years ago
Reply to  Mr Taxpayer

The bodies aren’t there and only the all cause death figures are of any use. This corrupt government will even try to fiddle those, even though it will be harder. Put nothing past them.

13
0
Silke David
Silke David
5 years ago
Reply to  Mr Taxpayer

I live opposite a funeral director, they are no more busy.
Just checked obituaries in our weekly paper, published today, average period death to funeral 3 weeks.
That is maybe a week more than usual, have seen it worse.

6
0
Cheezilla
Cheezilla
5 years ago
Reply to  Silke David

3 weeks not abnormal at this time of year.

4
0
BMWman
BMWman
5 years ago
Reply to  Silke David

This is high level satire, chapeau.

0
0
Bungle
Bungle
5 years ago

At least LS today starts with a positive story but then describes Sherelle Jacobs’ writing as a ‘thoughtful piece’. This is wrong as she has swallowed the establishment line 98%. She talks about vaccines being a good thing – sceptics know this is rubbish. She also says there are so many Covid cases under 60 in ICUs; this is also rubbish as no-one knows how to test for Covid. Please LS, stop publishing people talking nonsense and telling us they are ‘worth reading in full’!

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0
karenovirus
karenovirus
5 years ago
Reply to  Bungle

Steve Baker also says the key to returning to normality is vaccination.

20210115_055118.jpg
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0
chaos
chaos
5 years ago
Reply to  karenovirus

Steve Baker things the tories are beginning to lose support.. horse, door, bolted.

19
0
Jaguarpig
Jaguarpig
5 years ago
Reply to  chaos

As a life long Tory they can fuck off will never vote for them again.

Last edited 5 years ago by Jaguarpig
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0
Derek Toyne
Derek Toyne
5 years ago
Reply to  Jaguarpig

As a Labour supporter I will never vote for them again. As they the opposition they suppose to act on our behalf especially when lockdown as a far more devastating effect on the working class.

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0
Boris Bullshit
Boris Bullshit
5 years ago
Reply to  Derek Toyne

Its funny I have always thought that the left wing case against lockdown is very strong indeed and yet hardly any Lefties argue this. Any thought on why this is??

6
0
LMS2
LMS2
5 years ago
Reply to  Boris Bullshit

BB: Because lockdown is a method of population control.
Politics is less a Left-Right thing now, more liberal/conservative/populist vs elite/authoritarian dynamic. The latter is a sort of global /fascism being imposed on the greater populations from the top down.
The so-called right, i.e. Tories, Republicans, have conceded ground to the far left, so they’re fairly indistinguishable. The Left of past decades, who used to fight for civil liberties, human rights, etc, no longer do that. That fight has switched to the classic liberals and conservatives small c).
The far Left despises the working classes, as they’ve not risen up to fight off and overthrow their oppressors.
Those who do still believe in freedom of speech, individual liberties are now across the political spectrum, both the old left and right.

12
0
Crystal Decanter
Crystal Decanter
5 years ago
Reply to  Jaguarpig

At this point I will vote for anyone who promises the death penalty for every sitting politician that voted for lockdown

29
0
Rowan
Rowan
5 years ago
Reply to  Crystal Decanter

Yes it has to be that way. If we escape this coup then we must never allow to happen again. An arrest warrant for Bill Gates should also be a high priority.

19
-1
Victoria
Victoria
5 years ago
Reply to  Jaguarpig

Agree. Never vote conservative or labour (collaborated by failing to oppose) again

9
0
Spikedee1
Spikedee1
5 years ago
Reply to  karenovirus

You had you’re chance Steve, muffed it. Do you remember, a couple of weeks ago, there was a debate about ending this prison sentence for healthy people you voted for this motion. How the fuck did you think that was going to get us away from lockdown? Did the nasty chuckle brothers frighten you with their big numbers? Ooh, never mind, don’t do any research into the data, just run and hide. I mean you must be really busy, er, doing your job?? You have thrown away our democracy and we are now run by advisors like sage and phe and the chuckle brothers. They are all now stars going on the bbc and doing radio. Just fuck off.

29
0
Boris Bullshit
Boris Bullshit
5 years ago
Reply to  Spikedee1

He is a pathetic ‘conservative in name only’.

8
0
Basileus
Basileus
5 years ago
Reply to  Spikedee1

This is Steve Baker as reported in The Telegraph in December:

A MPs rebellion could be “enormous” if lockdown doesn’t end in December, Steve Baker has said. 
Mr Baker said that members of Government have made it clear to the whips that they would vote against a third lockdown. 
It comes after Richard Drax, the Tory MP for South Dorset, said as many as 100 Conservative MPs are willing to rebel against extending the national lockdown after December 2. 
Both Mr Drax and Mr Baker joined 53 Tories in defying the Prime Minister by failing to vote for the second nationwide Covid lockdown.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/11/19/mp-rebellion-could-enormous-lockdown-doesnt-end-december-says/

6
0
Rowan
Rowan
5 years ago
Reply to  karenovirus

Steve Baker is a treacherous prat.

Last edited 5 years ago by Rowan
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0
Rowan
Rowan
5 years ago
Reply to  Bungle

Toby’s establishment roots showing through again.

3
0
Anti_socialist
Anti_socialist
5 years ago

Johnson’s leadership under threat?

Comrade Alexander Johns-un is not a leader! & everything about covid19 is a fraudulent lie.

  1. A test that measures nothing!
  2. Masks that cause more harm than good!
  3. Social distancing that is futile!
  4. Lockdowns where the r number begins to fall before or shortly after they begin!
  5. RTA deaths recorded as covid deaths!
  6. A vaccine that doesn’t prevent infection!
  7. A cabinet that has pissed away billions if not trillions of £’s & hasn’t increased hospital bed capacity by even a single bed!

Come on, what are you waiting for, get rid of the tiers of a clown & the clown.

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0
Bungle
Bungle
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

Nice one M8 from a Socialist through and through, ‘for the many, not the few’.

11
0
Anti_socialist
Anti_socialist
5 years ago
Reply to  Bungle

There is only one reason i’m anti socialist, i’m anti authoritarian, the modern left are anti-freedom. I used to refer my political sympathies as libertarian socialist but covid was my vaccine against socialism. And i get more conservative (small c) the older i get, which i think is a natural evolution for most of us

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Annie
Annie
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

Love that book. Morris’s prose is much underrated. My favourite character is the dustman who wears cloth of gold. His friends think he’s bonkers, but as he’s a dustman you have to make allowances.

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Llamasaurus Rex
Llamasaurus Rex
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

similar to my journey. I wasn’t ever a self – described socialist libertarian though…more a freeish market liberal libertarian, with a respect for many labour types who wanted normal people to do well. Who cares for the working man or woman now in politics? Few.

Last edited 5 years ago by Llamasaurus Rex
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Crystal Decanter
Crystal Decanter
5 years ago
Reply to  Llamasaurus Rex

Woke has nothing to do with the real Left
As I keep[ pointing out to BLM freeks – there is nothing Woke in Marx+Engels
In fact, the Moors would be upset at some of the things they said about them

7
0
Nick Rose
Nick Rose
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

Both my grandfathers were staunch Labour men. Both reached adulthood in the 1930’s (one began working in 1928, having left school at 14). Both had an active role in the Second World War and, thankfully, both returned home. Their belief was that best health, best possible education, a welfare safety net to support those in need, social justice, decent housing and jobs for all would lead to a healthy and happy population. State ownership was not a problem because the State was their servant. They were also patriots, to both country and people. In fine, they wanted the best for as many people as possible, wanted things to get better. They may or may not have been misguided, but their beliefs were shaped by their life experiences. But what we see now – and not just from the Left, but also the Right – is pigs with snouts trapped in the trough. Our “public services” appear to believe they rule and not serve. Politicians are patriotic to themselves only, our health service is mediocre at best, our education system a shambles, welfare is apparently for the entire world at our expense, social justice is gone. The modern Left appear to… Read more »

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0
Spikedee1
Spikedee1
5 years ago
Reply to  Nick Rose

Well said. My dad was a labour supporter up till the say his union at Spittalfields market nearly lost them all their jobs going on strike. He was terrified we would lose our house as no money was coming in. He went cap in hand to the bank manager expecting a cuff round the ear. Instead he found an educated man who helped him stretch the mortgage a bit by freezing the payments for a couple of months. He was eternally grateful to this man who said as he was leaving, if you think the union guys have got your back, check out if they are all suffering. After returning to work he found the two union guys had been paid the whole time by the union! Never voted Labour again. I think the problem to me is there does not appear to be any difference between the two parties. They both have pictures of “our Tony” on their bedroom wall. Not because of his achievements but because of his popularity? The Labour still appears to have a sudo far left with the momentum gang, but they seem to be unelectable, these “freedom loving” rebels have been invisible during this… Read more »

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0
Nick Rose
Nick Rose
5 years ago
Reply to  Spikedee1

Modern politicians seem to chase power for power’s sake. None of them – or very few of them – have any actual ideas, or even a clue! This seems to be a global problem, in democracies at least. Maybe why we’re at where we’re at?

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0
Rowan
Rowan
5 years ago
Reply to  Spikedee1

Corbyn had to be neutralised and he was. Of course, he didn’t always help himself, but with treacherous Labour MPs, a bent media and Tony blair’s rich friends against him, Corbyn was always going to lose.

Last edited 5 years ago by Rowan
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Nigel Sherratt
Nigel Sherratt
5 years ago
Reply to  Nick Rose

The problem with your grandfathers’ plans is that the State gets to decide what best health, best possible education, a welfare safety net to support those in need, social justice, decent housing and jobs for all means with the results we see around us.

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0
TC
TC
5 years ago
Reply to  Nick Rose

Very compelling comment.
Ever thought of entering politics?

3
0
Burlington
Burlington
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

I fear that for many years our “Parliament ” has been a dung-market.
The people of this country are the mushrooms, kept in the dark and fed on the dung from the dung-market.

8
0
paulm
paulm
5 years ago
Reply to  Burlington

Led by an ex- fun guy

3
0
Derek Toyne
Derek Toyne
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

In the film A matter of life and death David Niven says he’s conservative by nature and labour by experience. I believe since covid everything as changed Boris is not Churchill he claims to be. The politicians are just inept and are to easily bamboozled into voting for the UK depise.

2
0
Jez Hewitt
Jez Hewitt
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

Kinda how I see things going if only Joe Public would snap the fuck out of this bollocks they’re currently treading water in.

3
0
jonathan Palmer
jonathan Palmer
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

You know you are in a coup when the one concrete thing the government could have done,strengthen the NHS in preparation for the ‘second wave ‘ which they were taking about almost immediately,they failed to do and they are never taken to task over this point.

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0
jos
jos
5 years ago
Reply to  jonathan Palmer

They were today in the briefing and just barefaced lied

2
0
jonathan Palmer
jonathan Palmer
5 years ago
Reply to  jos

I actually heard a BBC journalist ask Johnson that question before drifting off to sleep.I wonder what the answer was

1
0
Jaguarpig
Jaguarpig
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

Brilliant

5
0
Scotty87
Scotty87
5 years ago

It’s good to see Steve Baker speaking out again but the man is schizophrenic! He abstained from voting on the third lockdown when he should have been front, right and centre, beating his chest and crying out “NO MORE! ” from every corner of the Commons. I believe he’s playing a game. I don’t trust any of them, and here is why as Baker later tweeted:

“What this country needs is the complete success of
@BorisJohnson, with his excellent EU deal, a successful vaccination programme and a #Road2Recovery back to freedom. I am clear Boris is the only person to lead us out of these difficulties and I support him in that endeavour.”

So there we have it. Clearly mortified that his tinpot rebellion has been leaked to the Fat Dictator, he grovels to save his political career. Pathetic. The only route out of this is for life to get so miserable for so many that non-compliance becomes essential to survive – see the #IoApro movement in Italy for instance, where 50,000 restaurants are set to open simultaneously from today in a direct challenge to government restrictions. Best of luck to them.

Last edited 5 years ago by Scotty87
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0
Janette
Janette
5 years ago
Reply to  Scotty87

Yes we should do that too

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0
danny
danny
5 years ago
Reply to  Scotty87

It’s good that an MP is speaking out, we need all the numbers we can. But I agree. Absolutely pathetic toadying to fat boy. Happened countless times over Brexit with Theresa May, and now again. They threaten dissent only to slink back into the shadows at the first sign of personal risk to their career. I think for many of them, it is a CV strategy. Go down on paper as having been skeptical, so that they can later point to that moment to defend themselves next election without any immediate consequences. There’s exceptions. Graham Brady, Desmond Swain. But where’s the left wing firebrands? Those who since the 80s have been at odds with New labour and now see their poor communities decimated? There’s a few on the right, but as far as I can tell, the left are absolutely in line with Starmer?

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0
Burlington
Burlington
5 years ago
Reply to  danny

As you say:
“They threaten dissent only to slink back into the shadows at the first sign of personal risk to their career. I think for many of them, it is a CV strategy. Go down on paper as having been skeptical, so that they can later point to that moment to defend themselves next election without any immediate consequences.”
On current form. Do you think that there will be a next election? Bunter and his mates are quite capable of thinking up reasons to “postpone the locals in May, that are already overdue from May 2020.They may be may be afraid to discover what the electorate really think. Then they also have the fear that nice Mr Farage is waiting on the sidelines. Any bets on the general election in 2024?

7
0
stevie
stevie
5 years ago
Reply to  Burlington

There has been talk of postponing until November. Of course by then we may have colder weather and a new variant to protect the NHS from.

7
0
Jez Hewitt
Jez Hewitt
5 years ago
Reply to  Burlington

By autumn, depending on how US citizens react to things, this shitshow hits the fans. Germany are due a general election around then and if that’s cancelled or indefinitely postponed, I see things developing very quickly.

There’s a lot of pissed off Germans at present and it’s only going to get worse.

3
0
Anti_socialist
Anti_socialist
5 years ago
Reply to  Scotty87

I don’t trust any of them

Seconded

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0
Waldorf
Waldorf
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

I wouldn’t trust any of them, not even Dominic Swayne, who is more consistent on this than Baker. However, if they start suspecting that self-interest might be served by opposing this thing then that is a good indication the tide is turning.

7
0
Steven F
Steven F
5 years ago
Reply to  Waldorf

Desmond not Dominic and I trust him.

3
0
Bart Simpson
Bart Simpson
5 years ago
Reply to  Scotty87

As I said somewhere here in an indirect fashion, our businesses should copy Italy as their way of protesting against the government. I despair at how blind and stupid these businesses are not to realise that they’ve been had and are becoming complicit in their own demise.

Also demonstrated by the supermarkets recently although hopefully some push back is now happening.

16
0
Bart Simpson
Bart Simpson
5 years ago
Reply to  Bart Simpson

That’s frightening if that’s the case that said I wonder that surely the landlords must be despairing too because I don’t see them earning anything in terms of rent.

There was a frightening statistic from a shopping centre where apparently 9 out 10 couldn’t pay the rent.

7
0
Simon
Simon
5 years ago
Reply to  Bart Simpson

If I had a commercial lease I’d put an alternative to my landlord that I go bankrupt and leave them with an empty building and no rent. Then I would thank them for their support….

7
0
tonyspurs
tonyspurs
5 years ago
Reply to  Scotty87

Unfortunately KH if that happened I believe the public would light up there torches gather their pitchforks and march to said businesses and demand they shut to stop killing granny and protect the NHS such is the level of fear, brainwashing and virtue

Last edited 5 years ago by tonyspurs
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0
ituex
ituex
5 years ago
Reply to  tonyspurs

I think the zealots would shout/complain/call the police about it but I doubt they would actually DO anything personally.

11
0
Rowan
Rowan
5 years ago
Reply to  tonyspurs

No the public would do nothing, far too gutless.

5
0
BTLnewbie
BTLnewbie
5 years ago
Reply to  Scotty87

Seems to be similar in Poland as well:
https://mobile.twitter.com/Lyndonx/status/1349869764517232641
with the impact that Govt there is looking to go with the flow and ease restrictions. Can’t verify this of course. Any Poles on here?

9
0
Ovis
Ovis
5 years ago
Reply to  Scotty87

When I saw Baker’s words reported in the comments here yesterday I was slightly hopeful they might be significant.

What I find this morning is that, in effect, they are no more than a request to Johnson to guarantee it will all be over by Christmas 2021. He will of course do that, just as he guaranteed it would be over by Christmas 2020. We can all imagine the smirk as he says it.

8
0
Victoria
Victoria
5 years ago
Reply to  Scotty87

He abstained from voting on the third lockdown when he should have been front, right and centre, beating his chest and crying out “NO MORE! ” 

agree. He made a big mistake. It is all about political positioning. No trust

9
0
stevie
stevie
5 years ago
Reply to  Victoria

Maybe panic due to number of letters from his constituents.

4
0
Kevin 2
Kevin 2
5 years ago
Reply to  Scotty87

https://mobile.twitter.com/robinmonotti/status/1349677999206109184

Italian Opposition MP Vittorio Sgarbi showing how to express opposition.
And you really don’t need Italian to get the gist…

3
0
JanMasarykMunich
JanMasarykMunich
5 years ago
Reply to  Scotty87

Key to this is planning and critical mass. Restaurants tried to do this last week here in CH, but in the end not enough joined in. I think they also foolishly planned to open on a Monday during day. Better would have been, say, Thurs evening (when we — and I think many more — could have gone). But keeping fingers crossed for Italy. If it is really massive, then it will be difficult for the authorities. And will embolden those in other countries.

5
0
JanMasarykMunich
JanMasarykMunich
5 years ago
Reply to  Scotty87

Advice: I know that here in CH the restaurants were planning via telegram and were very wary of infiltration (by authorities). Of course, if the movement was really massive, then this might not be necessary.

4
0
Steven F
Steven F
5 years ago
Reply to  Scotty87

I keep hearing about Gab so I just had a look. Have you seen the Wikipedia reference? They describe it thus:

Gab is an American alt-techsocial networking service known for its far-right userbase. Widely described as a haven for extremists including neo-Nazis, white supremacists, white nationalists, and the alt-right, it has attracted users and groups who have been banned from other social media and users seeking alternatives to mainstream social media platforms. Gab claims to promote free speech and individual liberty, though these statements have been criticized as being a shield for its alt-right and extremist ecosystem. Antisemitism is prominent among the site’s content, and the company itself has engaged in antisemitic commentary on Twitter.

Well that demonstrates Wikipedia’s level of objectivity quite effectively, I’d say.

4
0
Steven F
Steven F
5 years ago
Reply to  Scotty87

KH. I just replied to your post and drew attention to Wikipedia’s denunciation of Gab. My post was removed within two minutes. I didn’t say anything defamatory or libellous about Wikipedia but questioned its objectivity. I thought we could speak freely here?

Last edited 5 years ago by WineDarkSteve
1
0
Rowan
Rowan
5 years ago
Reply to  Scotty87

Baker is showboating and he doesn’t mean a word of it.

1
0
SweetBabyCheeses
SweetBabyCheeses
5 years ago
Reply to  Scotty87

He was exactly like that on The Telegraph skeptics podcast “Planet Normal” too. Don’t think that the hosts knew what to make of him from one moment to the next! It’s obvious that you can’t slag off all of BJ’s policies, actions, principles etc and then praise him the next second just so that you don’t get in trouble with the whip. Might’ve worked in the office politics of the armed forces but not on a national stage.

1
0
Hugh
Hugh
5 years ago
Reply to  Scotty87

I seem to remember reading that, counterintuitively, North Korea has the most dynamic economy in the world, as you have to get creative to survive.

Anyhow, doesn’t sound like it’ll be too much fun whatever happens.

1
0
Londo Mollari
Londo Mollari
5 years ago

I’m sorry, but I don’t accept that the government is being driven by hyper-paranoia. The government itself is driving the hyper paranoia. MPs like Steve baker are, I’m afraid, part of the problem. They make bold statements of truth, only to run away at the slightest hint of resistance.

Last edited 5 years ago by Londo Mollari
76
0
jonathan Palmer
jonathan Palmer
5 years ago
Reply to  Londo Mollari

True.The government is the virus.

36
0
Nigel Sherratt
Nigel Sherratt
5 years ago
Reply to  jonathan Palmer

Unlike the virus it doesn’t become less deadly to survive.

5
0
Bungle
Bungle
5 years ago

You’ve also got ‘A doctor speaks’ showing 4 graphs from the NHS, 3 of which relate to Covid. Because we cannot test for Covid, these graphs are meaningless. Why has LS given this doctor space???

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-2
Ken Gardner
Ken Gardner
5 years ago
Reply to  Bungle

“A doctor speaks…”

And no reference point. Where are the comparative figures on bed occupancy and admissions for previous years? I think we are losing our way, getting bogged down in meaningless detail. The most impactful item today was the poster from AdapNation about hospital admissions.

Last edited 5 years ago by Ken Gardner
5
0
Spikedee1
Spikedee1
5 years ago
Reply to  Bungle

Yes I love going with the data. That’s the problem. The data is fucked up. Headline of the worse deaths since the pandemic began. No it fucking isn’t, they have stopped producing the total deaths and are only showing misdiagnosed covid deaths. I bet when they release the all cause deaths there is no increase on totals on the average. Stop doing reviews of half asset data and wait till all the information is available.

4
0
Annie
Annie
5 years ago

Talking of human rights: a petition to make them inviolable.

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/319489

9
0
Anti_socialist
Anti_socialist
5 years ago
Reply to  Annie

I had to look up “inviolable” first, LOL, but signed.

3
0
Annie
Annie
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

Learn a new word every day, it’s therapeutic!

1
0
JHUNTZ
JHUNTZ
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

https://patri-x.com/the-hague-agreement-of-1930-the-formation-of-the-bank-of-international-settlements-by-the-central-banks-under-the-auspices-of-german-reparation-payments-for-wwi/

The formation of the bank of international settlements. Essential the world ruling bank is where I learned about inviolability. You can skip to the formation of the banks articles if you get bored reading.

2
0
Bungle
Bungle
5 years ago

Further down, we have Toby complaining about ‘left-wing activists’.I’ve been one all my life and don’t want you attacking me when we are supposed to be on the same side re: Covid.

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Anti_socialist
Anti_socialist
5 years ago
Reply to  Bungle

To be fair, its two different topics that have converged, the cancel culture is mostly a leftist cause. I appreciate old skol socialists held freedom of speech as an inalienable right, (i do have many socialists empathies) & often it Eugene V. Debs as their inspiration, but he died long ago & it looks like those principals died with him, the modern left have no such values.

14
0
Fingerache Philip
Fingerache Philip
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

Fair point.

3
-1
Crystal Decanter
Crystal Decanter
5 years ago
Reply to  Anti_socialist

The Right had their fair share of cancel culture in the 80’s /90’s
Video games
Music (satanic panic , punk)
Movies (video nasties )
to name but a few

5
-1
Annie
Annie
5 years ago
Reply to  Bungle

I hope that most of us here agree on that. Agreement on the iniquity of lockdowns far outranks disagreements on other matters.
Before this bollox I’d have described myself as right-wing, but I think both ‘wings’ have now fallen off and the terms have become meaningless.
When the bollox ends, we can go back to l-r arguments if we want to.

Last edited 5 years ago by Annie
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0
Fingerache Philip
Fingerache Philip
5 years ago
Reply to  Annie

We will.
Looking forward to it, and leave/rejoiner argument.
HAPPY DAYS.

9
0
Boris Bullshit
Boris Bullshit
5 years ago
Reply to  Fingerache Philip

To be honest I think all the old conflicts over Brexit,identity politics,welfarism etc are completely irrelevant whilst all this is going on. If the economy is closed and our freedoms ended who cares about any other issue? I am amazed that anyone on Right or Left thinks they matter at the moment. I really dont care what people’s politics are at the moment…if they are against lockdown they are on my side.

7
0
danny
danny
5 years ago
Reply to  Annie

Political affiliation counts for very little when you are being hounded by a repressive regime. As a Corbyn voting, passionate remainer in the distant days before lockdown, my only friends now are my fellow anti-lockdowners, whoever they are. We all believe that we should live in a healthy country where those kind of debates should exist. Please, put tribalism aside and join together.

47
0
Fingerache Philip
Fingerache Philip
5 years ago
Reply to  danny

Danny, I am seriously putting our 48 year old marriage at risk.
I told my wife that (given the chance?) I will vote for Reform UK in any future? elections.
She said that “you will vote for a party whose values you have hated and detested all of your life, WHY?”
I class Nigel Farage as a bigger opportunist liar than the Bozzer (and that takes some doing) but I listened to Richard Tice on TR the other morning and apart from his right wing rhetoric of “a can do” attitude, I was impressed by his common sense ( as is TR) over the over hysterical measures supported by the main stream parties and the MSM.
When this madness is over then I will have to see what the situation will be in the future as pertains to “politics” and “common sense”.
As many FS’s have said: “it’s not right versus left, it’s sheep and collaborators against us”.

29
0
danny
danny
5 years ago
Reply to  Fingerache Philip

Really sorry for you. It is bad enough having a brother who is a lockdown enthusiast and parents who fluctuate by the hour between anger and fear. It has made family life a constant knife edge. But luckily my wife shares my beliefs, albeit less of an activist. Can’t imagine not having that respite when you close the door at night. These kind of forums are just so vital.
Like yourself, I have sworn never to vote labour again. Not a conservative either and certainly not now. Greens are a one trick pony. LibDems have all the solidity of a windsock. I will never give any of these my vote after what they have collectively done. If Reform UK are viable and have decided that ending the lockdown is important, then they have my vote too. Absolutely.

20
0
Bart Simpson
Bart Simpson
5 years ago
Reply to  danny

Agree. That’s where Mr Bart and I part company – he still thinks that voting Labour is the best way of getting rid of the majority and our useful as a chocolate teapot Tory MP. But I disagree as I’ve had enough of the mainstream parties – Tory, Labour, Lib Dem and even Green; they’re all in it and can go to hell for all I care.

That said Mr Bart does regret voting for that shitweasel Sadiq Khan as mayor and now can’t wait to vote him out.

11
0
Crystal Decanter
Crystal Decanter
5 years ago
Reply to  Bart Simpson

Splitting the protest vote ain’t going to work either
There has to be one
and only one

7
0
Bart Simpson
Bart Simpson
5 years ago
Reply to  Crystal Decanter

That’s why I think the likes of Reform and Reclaim should merge as one party. A friend suggested I check out the SDP.

6
0
EllGee
EllGee
5 years ago
Reply to  Bart Simpson

Yes, as they would appeal to different parts of the country and different voters

1
0
Cheezilla
Cheezilla
5 years ago
Reply to  Bart Simpson

Look up communitarianism, then have another, more sceptical, look at the SDP.

0
0
Fingerache Philip
Fingerache Philip
5 years ago
Reply to  danny

Thank you Danny, for your kind, supportive and constructive comments.
Our marriage has survived many problems and it will survive this.
Thank you once again.

4
0
Crystal Decanter
Crystal Decanter
5 years ago
Reply to  Fingerache Philip

At this point a protest party is all we have
I saw Katie Hopkins has joined UKIP
I would laugh myself into the grave if she ever got elected

3
0
Fingerache Philip
Fingerache Philip
5 years ago
Reply to  Crystal Decanter

BLOODY HELL, CD, I DIDN’T THINK/KNOW THAT UKIP STILL EXISTED.

3
0
Simon
Simon
5 years ago
Reply to  Fingerache Philip

Eventually everyone will be on the right side, which we think is most definitely ours.

Everyone was in the French resistance, after the war….. which gives everyone the opportunity to openly criticise, complain and side with those who they didn’t align with before.

4
0
Nigel Sherratt
Nigel Sherratt
5 years ago
Reply to  Simon

Yes, they were all at Woodstock too during HK flu so of course they were sceptics.

1
0
Fingerache Philip
Fingerache Philip
5 years ago
Reply to  Simon

Well said, Simon.

0
0
Covidiot
Covidiot
5 years ago
Reply to  danny

Totally agree. From the same background. I think the problem with this virus response has, in large part, due to political posturing and divide and rule tactics by the political mainstream. This has been made into a political argument and has essentially asked people to take sides. Political tribalism has ensued. If your a sceptic you support Brexit and Trump, if you are a lockdown zealot you are one of us, the nice guys. Some posters on this website seem to have swallowed this whole and seem intent on entrenching those divisions through their comments. But, peeking through the fog of bullshit, it quickly becomes apparent that there are many people with left wing values who are equally as angry about all this as those on the right. It is so vitally important that this infighting does not spread as the authorities want it to do. You might not realise it but this is the trap they want us to fall into. Left wing, right wing, it doesn’t matter. Those on the right should be pleased there are left wing voices in this debate because it means that these divide and rule tactics have only worked to a certain degree.… Read more »

11
0
Fingerache Philip
Fingerache Philip
5 years ago
Reply to  Covidiot

We must not fall into the “Divide and conquer” trap.

4
0
Marialta
Marialta
5 years ago
Reply to  Annie

Exactly! Before this bollox I’d have described myself as left-wing now I have more in common with the other side and don’t care about wings anymore. Fighting alongside others with diverse views for a bigger unifying cause is always progressive.

34
0
Bart Simpson
Bart Simpson
5 years ago
Reply to  Marialta

Half the time left and right don’t really matter. Some of the most unpleasant people I’ve encountered are from the “caring” left.

21
0
Nigel Sherratt
Nigel Sherratt
5 years ago
Reply to  Bart Simpson

“We’re from the government and we’re here to help you.”

1
0
Bart Simpson
Bart Simpson
5 years ago
Reply to  Nigel Sherratt

The most terrifying sentence in the English language.

2
0
Londo Mollari
Londo Mollari
5 years ago
Reply to  Marialta

And I would have described Piers Corbyn as crazy! But now I see him as a man of courage, a hero. Still with some crazy ideas, but a hero. If we don’t see our commonalities we’ll be debating our differences in the camps – which will be fascist or communist depending on your ideology of choice.

30
0
Spikedee1
Spikedee1
5 years ago
Reply to  Londo Mollari

Yep me too but the man has some adamantium king sized balls. If 30% of the country were as brave as him this crap would have been over by Christmas!

8
0
Nigel Sherratt
Nigel Sherratt
5 years ago
Reply to  Londo Mollari

Mixed camps surely to increase violence and death?

0
0
Simon
Simon
5 years ago
Reply to  Marialta

I like the fact that it’s brought both supposed sides together.

But, isn’t the left and right a construct to get the population separated into smaller groups. The illusion of one side winning in a democratic election seems to be just that now.

Doesn;t matter what side you’re on, no-one ever gets what they want. The people should be one side, the government and the dictating technocrats should be the, very small, other.

3
0
TC
TC
5 years ago
Reply to  Marialta

The enemy of my enemy is my friend.

0
0
karenovirus
karenovirus
5 years ago
Reply to  Annie

I hope the authoritarian/libertarian divide comes comes to dominate politics.

6
0
Fingerache Philip
Fingerache Philip
5 years ago
Reply to  Bungle

Me too.
Starting in the 60’s ( anti Vietnam war marches).

4
0
Bungle
Bungle
5 years ago

And Toby, I wrote to the BBC complaining about Maitlis but there has been no resurgence so why did you give her ammunition? Fire shots at the opposition, not what’s attached to the end of your leg!

12
-1
Boris Bullshit
Boris Bullshit
5 years ago
Reply to  Bungle

Because he still wants his seat in the Lords lol.

1
0
Cheezilla
Cheezilla
5 years ago
Reply to  Bungle

Yes, Still reiterating it in today’s segment. Disappointing!

2
0
Annie
Annie
5 years ago

Government response to petition not to implement mass testing in schools:

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/563806

Stable door, horse, bolted?

8
0
Scotty87
Scotty87
5 years ago

Following on from an earlier post about the thousands of restaurants reopening “illegally” in Italy, imagine if the same happened here, and it soon spread to gyms, bars, pubs & hairdressers. How many of these businesses would be supported by their regulars and the wider public? I suspect quite a few. THAT would be the true marker of support for the government’s draconian policies – if these businesses could sustain themselves despite flouting the restrictions, then all of the polls claiming support for these measures collapse overnight. The yearning for normality will be proven to outweigh fear of the virus.

That I suspect is what the government is absolutely petrified of – a large scale revolt showing that actually, they do NOT have the backing of the people. Then, the mask will slip once and for all – the heavy-handed response by Johnson and Co will force the public to quickly realise that we are being ruled by a clutch of evil despots, not a benevolent, compassionate state who simply want to “save lives.”

It can only end one way for these bastards.

71
0
jonathan Palmer
jonathan Palmer
5 years ago
Reply to  Scotty87

Mass civil disobedience is the only route out of this.
Parliament,The Courts and the media are a waste of time.
The government and their advisors are flexing their muscles,cue Fersguson telling us that restrictions will last until autumn which at that point they will start again,ready for another winter.
The public mood has changed,people are sick of the continuing rules.Look at the failiure of the NHS clap.
I believe we will have a small window when the weather breaks,the majority of the ‘vunerable will have been jabbed,Even the most brain dead person wi realise there is no more rationale for continued restrictions.

63
0
Boris Bullshit
Boris Bullshit
5 years ago
Reply to  jonathan Palmer

This is where people like Peter Hitchens get it wrong. Much as I admire him in some ways sorry Peter your idea of us all writing to our MPs was a total failure as the number of MPs who voted against lockdown went down drastically. I have no faith in MPs,the courts etc….the whole rotten establishment is corrupt and toes the tyrannical government line. Peter needs to wake up an smell the coffee.

9
0
Rowan
Rowan
5 years ago
Reply to  Boris Bullshit

The hole we are now in is a far far deeper than most people can begin to comprehend. The problem is ours and there won’t be a future if we don’t fix it now.

4
0
Bart Simpson
Bart Simpson
5 years ago
Reply to  Scotty87

Agree. As I’ve said here before, if my mangers decide to flout the restrictions and open regardless, I will be the first to volunteer to come to work and welcome visitors.

The government seems to think that they’ve got public compliance but definitely the cracks are showing and are getting bigger.

What’s really needed is more of a push back like in Italy and the rest to follow.

28
0
Spikedee1
Spikedee1
5 years ago
Reply to  Bart Simpson

My daughter works for a BMW dealers, they did not close for the last lockdown as they were cheating as a click and collect and car service operation. They have remained open but got shopped by a lockdown zealot and had a visit yesterday. So now they (and I swear this is true) are all sitting in the dark with the blinds pulled down on the sales side. Rock on!! Need more firms to do this!

21
0
Bart Simpson
Bart Simpson
5 years ago
Reply to  Spikedee1

That’s brave of them and at this rate, everything will become a “black market.”

Maybe I should float the same idea to my managers – TOP SECRET MUSEUM

8
0
Ambwozere
Ambwozere
5 years ago
Reply to  Scotty87

If this happens in Italy then hopefully it will spread across the rest of Europe and maybe here. Though given the reaction of people on Facebook to the mass snowball fight in West Yorkshire yesterday I’m not convinced people would support businesses who opened up.

6
0
Scotty87
Scotty87
5 years ago
Reply to  Ambwozere

Social media is largely just zealots on both sides screaming into the ether. I think the average Joe or Jane would be a lot more sympathetic – I reckon there’s plenty in the UK who are yearning for a nice meal, a few pints, a smart haircut or an indoor training session right now!

11
0
Annie
Annie
5 years ago
Reply to  Scotty87

A cup of coffee and a bun in a cosy café with happy holidaymakers strolling past the windows.
To think that I once took that for granted…

19
0
thinkaboutit
thinkaboutit
5 years ago
Reply to  Annie

I’d even suffer being stranded on Lindisfarne at high tide for that.

2
0
Bart Simpson
Bart Simpson
5 years ago
Reply to  Ambwozere

As David Cameron once said Twitter is not Britain.

And I think he’s right. Plus there’s some hypocrisy going on too. How many people take to their anti-social media accounts denouncing the likes of us a “Covidiots” but behind the scenes break the “rules” themselves?

11
0
Waldorf
Waldorf
5 years ago
Reply to  Bart Simpson

It is probably impossible not to break the rules. 100% compliance is virtually impossible. That guy being told off by a cop od Covid marshal for breathing too heavily, for example. The only people who do not breathe are dead…

9
0
Annie
Annie
5 years ago
Reply to  Waldorf

Being dead is the ideal state. You can’t break the rules, you can’t protest, you swell the essential death-porn figures, and as you’ve stopped breathing, you can’t emit that toxic green killer goo. It’a a wonder more zombies don’t embrace this wonderful virtue signal.

14
0
Bart Simpson
Bart Simpson
5 years ago
Reply to  Annie

It’s the same with the Greens. I’ve always wondered why don’t they be honest and admit that they want the extinction of the human race? That said they might be forced to commit hara-kiri to set an example.

6
0
Rowan
Rowan
5 years ago
Reply to  Bart Simpson

It’s not just the Greens who are eagerly looking forward to a world without people.

0
0
Spikedee1
Spikedee1
5 years ago
Reply to  Annie

This is true and the reason I have spent the last year dead. It was hard not opening my birthday prezzies but I got through it. Oh Douglas Adams, we could really do with you still being around!

3
0
Bart Simpson
Bart Simpson
5 years ago
Reply to  Waldorf

That’s a stupid comment by the police and well done to the bloke for calling him out on his stupidity.

That was what I told a colleague who whined that “if only people followed the rules.” I retorted that 100% compliance is only possible if we all committed mass suicide. That left her speechless.

8
0
PastImperfect
PastImperfect
5 years ago
Reply to  Scotty87

Publicise the opening up FROM (not on) 21st.
(I have been suggesting St Valentine’s Day to give time to spread the word, but all the better if 21st works for enough venues.)
Verify the date, then everybody spread the word.

0
0
miahoneybee
miahoneybee
5 years ago

Mps had their chance to do something. Only 16 attempted to do so. S Baker you had many chances. You abstained. All cowards him included. Their own careers come before stopping this bullshit despite them all knowing the consequences of lockdowns . ( I know a large number are actually thick 😊 ) most have turned a blind eye.i am also sick of giving space to some of these stories on here which are getting more frequent.

41
0
Spikedee1
Spikedee1
5 years ago
Reply to  miahoneybee

The WFH crowd do not give a crap about lockdown. They and the silver top big pension crowd I suggest are the vast majority of lockdown zealots.

5
0
Boris Bullshit
Boris Bullshit
5 years ago
Reply to  Spikedee1

Maybe we should just get our pliers out and cut the cables to the houses of the WFH brigade…that should end their smugness lol.

3
0
leggy
leggy
5 years ago
Reply to  Spikedee1

Point of order – I’m a WFHer and I have been for more than a decade when not travelling for business (obviously not doing that anymore!). I couldn’t possibly be more anti this lockdown shit show. Maybe it’s the new found WFHers who now don’t have to commute or spend a fiver a day in Pret any more though.

7
0
Bart Simpson
Bart Simpson
5 years ago
Reply to  Spikedee1

Economic Armageddon will get them to change their tune. There will be weeping, wailing and gnashing of teeth when their jobs either go or are outsourced. Or their pensions are taxed and/or lose their value.

2
0
wendyk
wendyk
5 years ago

https://www.aier.org/article/study-indicates-lockdowns-have-increased-deaths-of-despair/

The AIER again: excess deaths caused by lockdown-induced despair.

7
0
Steve-Devon
Steve-Devon
5 years ago

Whilst we may have our criticisms of what appears in this newsletter, it does now seem to represent the only source of any attempt at an incisive and rational challenge to the covid zealot narrative. It did look for a time that the CEBM headed by Carl Heneghan might be taking on that role but it would seem that they have been ‘nobbled’ and we now hear little from them.
Carl Heneghan did recently re-tweet an item about ONS death stats but made no comment himself. It was clear from the comments to that re-tweet that a proper presentation and analysis of death stats is needed but it now seems we are dependent on Will and Toby doing this sort of thing and presenting the comments here. Certainly I am very grateful that they are doing this and that, so far, this site has been able to continue.

41
0
Viv
Viv
5 years ago
Reply to  Steve-Devon

GMTA! I was very puzzled about the sudden absence of Prof Henegan in reports. There’s only the update of their Nightingale Diagram on the CEBM website. One cannot help but wonder if indeed he, his co-workers and the institute have been told to shut up or else …

22
0
eastender53
eastender53
5 years ago
Reply to  Viv

There can be no doubt of that I feel. Funding, employment, all are vulnerable to Big Brother. Sadly Mike Yeadon also appears to be less active. This is scarier as he is financially independent. Of course ‘they’ know where he lives……..

6
0
Dermot McClatchey
Dermot McClatchey
5 years ago
Reply to  eastender53

I’ve not heard anything from Michael Levitt for a long time, either.

3
0
Bart Simpson
Bart Simpson
5 years ago

The MPs who are against all this insanity should be more robust in their opposition and if needs be trigger a vote of no confidence in this government.

Businesses, institutions and venues should stop pussyfooting and kowtowing to the government. Surely they should know by now that they’ve been complicit in their own demise. They should follow the example of Italy and open en masse with no restrictions and no “Covid safety” measures. Remember businesses outnumber the police and council authorities.

Sure they will get fined and attempts will be made to close them but like the gym owners and that hairdresser, cry foul, refuse to pay and demand that it goes to court. If they all did this, the authorities will be tied down for the next 50,000 years.

Meanwhile we ordinary members of the public should carry on ignoring the rules and restrictions and fight back any insanity whenever we can.

Remember it ain’t over until WE say it’s over.

30
0
Cecil B
Cecil B
5 years ago

I do not see any point in writing to a dictatorship asking them not to be a dictatorship

Don’t think it works like that

Last edited 5 years ago by Cecil B
40
0
Annie
Annie
5 years ago
Reply to  Cecil B

I suppose it indicates that we know it’s a dictatorship.

9
0
FerdIII
FerdIII
5 years ago
Reply to  Annie

It may land you on the ‘enemies’ list at some point…..

5
0
Annie
Annie
5 years ago
Reply to  FerdIII

I’m on it anyway.

5
0
Crystal Decanter
Crystal Decanter
5 years ago
Reply to  Cecil B

Mao often bumped off a few less due to letters from the proles

2
0
Boris Bullshit
Boris Bullshit
5 years ago
Reply to  Cecil B

Yes get real Peter Hitchens.

0
0
Cheshirecatslave
Cheshirecatslave
5 years ago

Quite a good opinion piece about snitches from the Guardian. The comments are horrendous.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/jan/13/lockdowns-uk-true-character-nation-snitches-useless-leaders#comment-146663409

9
0
Bart Simpson
Bart Simpson
5 years ago
Reply to  Cheshirecatslave

A fairly good piece if only ruined by the sneering aside on businesses but it’s spot on with pointing out what we’ve said repeatedly here – people’s capacity for evil masquerading as good.

13
0
Cheshirecatslave
Cheshirecatslave
5 years ago
Reply to  Bart Simpson

Never before have I known good and evil so mixed up. I guess that is what happens in a police state.I was brought up with my parents telling me how lucky we were to live in a free country too

8
0
Bart Simpson
Bart Simpson
5 years ago
Reply to  Cheshirecatslave

It’s bonkers agree and it forces you to see people in a different light. I’ve began to despise a lot of people including my own family for their weakness and complicity in all of this.

6
0
Cheshirecatslave
Cheshirecatslave
5 years ago
Reply to  Cheshirecatslave

How can they be so blind as to think ‘rulebreakers’ are driving the pandemic when most infections are picked up in hospitals. supermarkets or at work? The likelihood of maskless people transmitting it out of doors is remote.

5
0
james007
james007
5 years ago

Steve Baker warns the Government that people are “loosing faith” in the Government. NO Mr Baker. People have LOST faith in the Government, and they have also LOST faith in you.

47
0
Bart Simpson
Bart Simpson
5 years ago
Reply to  james007

I bet he doesn’t realise that he’s part of the problem. In fact all the MPs bar a few honourable exceptions are.

17
0
WasSteph
WasSteph
5 years ago
Reply to  james007

Yes, I told my MP, the useless and bullying Home Secretary, that she has lost my vote for ever. This cannot and will not ever be forgotten or forgiven.
Hard to negotiate a way out of that divide!

Last edited 5 years ago by WasSteph
10
0
WasSteph
WasSteph
5 years ago
Reply to  WasSteph

Which does leave us with a problem. What’s in it for them if we are never going to support them again anyway? Just hang on as long as they can now, I suppose.
We do need all the pubs, cafes, shops, gyms, hairdressers etc to open up en masse and refuse fines. We can crowd fund the show trials if they are pushed that far before the whole thing collapses.

Last edited 5 years ago by WasSteph
12
0
Annie
Annie
5 years ago
Reply to  WasSteph

‘We’ is a minority. Zombies will either think that the gov is doing a terrific job of enslaving the country, or think that Starmer could do it better.

6
0
WasSteph
WasSteph
5 years ago
Reply to  Annie

I know we are in the minority, unfortunately. However, there is clearly lockdown fatigue out there; the parks and beaches last weekend can’t only have been occupied by readers of this blog.

5
0
Annie
Annie
5 years ago
Reply to  WasSteph

True, o queen!

0
0
Boris Bullshit
Boris Bullshit
5 years ago
Reply to  WasSteph

En masse civil dis obedience is the only way out of this and businesses need to wake up instead of believing all the bullshit. Forget MPs…they are only concerned with their careers.

5
0
Boris Bullshit
Boris Bullshit
5 years ago
Reply to  WasSteph

God she is the worst….love the way she tries to sound tough…all 5ft 8 stone of her lol.

0
0
Bart Simpson
Bart Simpson
5 years ago

I get cheesed off with newspaper headlines and articles that still blame the virus for this and that. When will they get it into their thick skulls that it was lockdown that did it?

13
0
Scotty87
Scotty87
5 years ago

Shameful from the formerly sceptical Mail this morning, their front page is claiming that the R number has dropped and these figures “are the strongest evidence yet that the lockdown is working.”

What, with millions more key workers mingling together and every man and his dog (literally) cramming into parks every weekend? Any mention towards the fact that infections were actually falling before the lockdown began?

Yet another one probably given a slap on the wrist by Ofcom and told to stay in line. Embarrassing beyond belief.

10
0
Scotty87
Scotty87
5 years ago
Reply to  Scotty87

Mercifully NN I didn’t purchase the rag – I could never have it on my conscience to personally fund such egregious lies and propaganda. Totally agree with your point though.

3
0
james007
james007
5 years ago
Reply to  Scotty87

It is a fallacy. When the relationship between two things is unproven (lockdowns, lower death rates/saving the NHS), saying that one happened after the other does not show a cause. Especially if countries with different approaches are also seeing the virus become less prevalent.

3
0
DanClarke
DanClarke
5 years ago
Reply to  Scotty87

The DM is a propaganda rag they also have a lot of paid bots too, replying to each other

6
0
Boris Bullshit
Boris Bullshit
5 years ago
Reply to  Scotty87

I shall never buy any newspaper again…they are all a disgrace.

2
0
FerdIII
FerdIII
5 years ago

Fake Data Parade continues. Do any MPs have a brain to challenge these fake numbers or anyone in the Fake News Half wit complex ?

1300 dead Jan 13th. 1600 Jan 14th…..

2018 2nd week in Jan – 2000 died per day on average from the Flu-Resp-Pneumonia….2021 suddenly the these 3 cats are down close to zero…..

What happened to the 1700 people who normally die each day in the UK? Their own numbers do not add up.

25
0
Julian
Julian
5 years ago
Reply to  FerdIII

And there you have it in a nutshell. Until we get the real numbers in context in front of people on a daily basis we’re on the back foot

The report in the Mail yesterday of the Baker statements about the PM had right smack bang in the middle of it a graph showing covid deaths nearly as high as the spring peak, which is clearly a massive distortion of what is really going on

13
0
FerdIII
FerdIII
5 years ago
Reply to  Julian

Yes and the ONS stats only available for week ending Jan 1, so can’t look at the total data sets. I have little confidence in the veracity of the published stats, especially when comparing to years previous, in which it is clear that they are moving flu-resp-pneu into CV 19 – by my reckoning well over 30 K dead.

I built an app based on their data to do analysis….and their data sets are to be blunt, a bloody joke. NHS ‘agencies’ feed the ONS, there is no ‘end to end’ verifiable process, nor data validation. The data sets published are csv files and they are manipulated.

Within data sets I found that their own numbers do not add up ie. if I add up by week to get a month and they have published a sub data set of totals by month, the details by week, do not add up to the monthly summary file.

11
0
kvnmoore561
kvnmoore561
5 years ago
Reply to  FerdIII

Has anyone tried to put these figures into context and are they actually accurate (something that I highly doubt)? Is this reported deaths? Since everyone going into hospital is now tested and if they test positive and then die are they all getting put down as Covid (this is something that I’ve anecdotally heard is happening)? If this is distorting what is really going on, which I think it is, then what is the real situation? It seems to me that even though these figures are supposedly worse than the first ‘wave’ – I hate that term – people are acting a lot differently, the roads are busy, people are going out, etc. It’s just so insane the situation that we find ourselves in.

5
0
FerdIII
FerdIII
5 years ago
Reply to  kvnmoore561

The entire data collection, publishing workflows needs a huge, thorough end to end audit, starting with the MCCD and going forward all the way to the ONS published csv files. This must be demanded in Parliament.

We also need a 2nd audit on financial incentives, are hospitals receiving more of the billions in CV budget if they ramp up the CV porn?

Under March 2020 new laws, the old system of the MCCD was stopped. The new one is subjective – one doctor who does not need to see you before you die, can assess why you died, no clinical proof is now needed. So if the nurse says you had a fever etc it might be that CV shows up on the MCCD (there may be more budget avail for the hospital in this case). And, the presence of any flu RNA even post death (tested or not before you die) would probably mean the same.

It would be nice if an MP or someone in the Fake News understood something about data flows including how corrupted most ‘big data flows’ are in real life.

6
0
PastImperfect
PastImperfect
5 years ago
Reply to  kvnmoore561

In hospital, anyone testing negative is tested again and again until they test positive.

0
0
Steve-Devon
Steve-Devon
5 years ago
Reply to  FerdIII

In my personal view the only death data that stands as absolutely correct and irrefutable is the ONS published total of registered deaths from all causes. The death registration system is well established even after coronavirus act modifications and the figures are the gold standard. One of the issues is that when this hoo-haa started they decided that death registration data was coming out too slowly and so they set up a fast system to get daily data but that inevitably has lead to dodgy data especially the weird data of deaths within 28 days of a +ve test. You might as well publish data on deaths within 28 days of cutting your toenails and then blame toenail cutting for deaths. What really annoys me is when people say that deaths are as bad now as they were in April/May when the ONS total deaths were over double the 5 year average compared to now when we are about normal. Mind you i have seen people on Twitter effectively arguing that the reason there are few other respiratory deaths at present is due to face-masks and social distancing and that if we did not have covid but had still taken… Read more »

18
0
Burlington
Burlington
5 years ago
Reply to  Steve-Devon

I have a bridge to sell them!

1
0
DeepBlueYonder
DeepBlueYonder
5 years ago
Reply to  FerdIII

Year to date number of deaths and age-standardised mortality rates, deaths registered between 1 January and 30 November 2001 to 2020, England
Year   Number of deaths Rate per 100,000 population
2001   454,756     1,227.9
2002   454,687     1,216.1
2003   454,801     1,207.8
2004   436,209     1,146.0
2005   437,603     1,134.7
2006   432,515     1,105.2
2007   429,654     1,082.7
2008   425,657     1,060.0
2009   416,450     1,018.3
2010   416,028     997.7
2011   412,119     968.0
2012   427,111      982.3
2013   433,578      979.5
2014   422,396      933.6
2015   452,814      985.6
2016   448,167      958.2
2017   456,588      959.8
2018   467,149      965.7
2019   452,084      915.0
2020   517,148      1,029.4

Source: https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/monthlymortalityanalysisenglandandwales/november2020 .

My reading of this is that in terms of Mortality Rates per 100,000 people, while 2020 is certainly out of kilter with the preceding 10 years, it is not at all out of kilter with the 9 years before then. These data are for the period January to November only (and for England only). I think the data for January to December are due to be published on 18 January. We will then be able to see the Age-Standardised Mortality Rate per 100,000 for the whole of this calendar year.

What is striking is mortality rate from January to November 2019. This was extraordinarily low, possibly connected with a very mild winter in January/February 2019?

Sorry, I can’t get the columns of data neatly aligned!

Last edited 5 years ago by DeepBlueYonder
12
0
BTLnewbie
BTLnewbie
5 years ago
Reply to  DeepBlueYonder

Would be fascinating to rerun this but excluding the 10 weeks when we had a pandemic in the uk – mid-Mar to end May.
To show that the old man with the scythe has been operating as normal from 1 Jun.

3
0
DeepBlueYonder
DeepBlueYonder
5 years ago
Reply to  BTLnewbie

Age-standardised mortality rates deaths registered in January 2001 to November 2020, England

Period       Rate per 100,000 population
November 2020    1,057.4
October 2020    925.7
September 2020   882.3
August 2020    746.0
July 2020    820.8
June 2020    886.9
May 2020    1,064.4
April 2020    1,859.6
March 2020    1,005.3
February 2020    943.6
January 2020    1,148.6

Source: Table 1, https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/monthlymortalityanalysisenglandandwales/november2020

Yes, April 2020 stands out. These data are by date of registration of death, so there is almost certain to be a small lag compared with date of death.

2
0
Spikedee1
Spikedee1
5 years ago
Reply to  DeepBlueYonder

Great analysis. How would this stack against a really bad flu season?

2
0
Ned of the Hills
Ned of the Hills
5 years ago
Reply to  DeepBlueYonder

Much thanks for this. I hope you can update it when stats for the full year come in.

Seeing figures like this suggest to me the NHS has done a very good job in helping people to live longer. So the percentage of vulnerable people has been steadily increasing over the past decade or so.

2
0
DeepBlueYonder
DeepBlueYonder
5 years ago
Reply to  Ned of the Hills

Yes, I will look out for the December publication. We will then be able to make a comparison between the 2020 mortality rate per 100,000 in England and the preceding 19 years.

1
0
Major Panic in the jabby jabbys
Major Panic in the jabby jabbys
5 years ago
Reply to  DeepBlueYonder

per 100,000 population

2016, 2017, 2018 are all about 960 deaths

2019 had a low death year (915) leaving many more ready to pop their clogs in 2020 which had a higher death year (1029) – average deaths over these two years 972 deaths
(including deaths from ceasing non-covid healthcare/hospital services)

average deaths over last 20 years is 1043

1
0
Nigel Sherratt
Nigel Sherratt
5 years ago
Reply to  Major Panic in the jabby jabbys

51 drop from 2018 to 2019 (966 to 915). Add that back to 2018’s 966 gets you to 1016 (to nearest whole number) which isn’t far off 2020’s 1029. So ‘dry tinder’ plus lack of access to NHS for many accounts for it.

3
0
mhcp
mhcp
5 years ago

In cases were models drive policy and the feedback is official data, there is a feedback loop where official data is massaged to make the models look good, even though this is completely disconnected with reality.

Because the sunken cost of relying on the models cannot be accepted.

Has it not dawned on people yet that the only reason we are still in this mess is that politicians and institutions are covering their arses? That has absolutely nothing to do with the reality of the flu season and all to do with dodging liabilty.

In other words, the Health and Safety complex pushed to its logical conclusion.

19
0
Tommo
Tommo
5 years ago
Reply to  mhcp

Yes, I have been thinking more about this recently. It is going to be very difficult, maybe impossible, for all the scientists, politicians and journalists who advocate for lockdowns, to admit they have messed up, as the stakes are too high. So the scientists keep meddling and forecasting more doom, the journalists keep broadcasting the fear and panic and the government reacts with more restrictions. How the bloody hell do we ever break this cycle of destruction?

12
0
Cecil B
Cecil B
5 years ago
Reply to  Tommo

You don’t, nobody does. Welcome to your future

3
0
rockoman
rockoman
5 years ago
Reply to  Tommo

Economic collapse and violent upheaval is how it has usually gone in history.

No reason why it should be different this time.

6
0
Nigel Sherratt
Nigel Sherratt
5 years ago
Reply to  Tommo

The magical snake oil will ‘cure all’ and provide the pols’ escape route is their plan I think. Be interesting to see if they can pull it off.

2
0
PastImperfect
PastImperfect
5 years ago
Reply to  Tommo

Exercise our freedoms all together starting St. Valentines day. No more restrictions.
With freedoms come responsibilities, a concept that the “government” itself is incapable of comprehending.

2
0
Ewan Duffy
Ewan Duffy
5 years ago
Reply to  mhcp

People have been driven by fear into accepting whatever they are told. My Dad was a career civil servant and during his career, had as low a bullshit tolerance level as I have – even from other civil servants.

Since he has retired (11 years now), he has done a complete turn around and believes all the fear porn put out by the modern State. Arguments from me that he knows the State lies to get its message across (as he was on the inside at a senior level) fall on deaf ears.

3
0
PastImperfect
PastImperfect
5 years ago
Reply to  mhcp

They are following the plan.

1
0
Andrew K
Andrew K
5 years ago

I think there’s a national call out to all businesses closed in the UK to do the same on the 21st Jan. If they all open and all take their fines to court then the Tyranny stops. The Dictators can’t win that battle. Start calling this out now. Open without fear. I will be the first to eat in whatever restaurant decides to open near me.

46
0
DanClarke
DanClarke
5 years ago
Reply to  Andrew K

Excellent, me too

9
0
Bart Simpson
Bart Simpson
5 years ago
Reply to  Andrew K

Hear, hear!!!!

4
0
Andrew K
Andrew K
5 years ago
Reply to  Andrew K

I saw a flyer on one of the National Alliance telegram groups, but I need to find it again.

5
0
Nigel Sherratt
Nigel Sherratt
5 years ago
Reply to  Andrew K

Cops will find (speechless) Inspector Salvo Montalbano dining at one of them I’m pretty certain.

5
0
Boris Bullshit
Boris Bullshit
5 years ago
Reply to  Andrew K

Me too without a doubt.

0
0
Rowan
Rowan
5 years ago
Reply to  Andrew K

We need all pubs to do the same. Resistance is the only way out of this mess.

1
0
Cecil B
Cecil B
5 years ago

‘Steve Baker demands’

What like Chamberlain demands Hitler doesn’t invade Czechoslovakia?

A comic opera

17
0
thinkaboutit
thinkaboutit
5 years ago
Reply to  Cecil B

We need a resurgence of Gilbert & Sullivan with suitably derisive lyrics.

Last edited 5 years ago by think-about-it
3
0
Nigel Sherratt
Nigel Sherratt
5 years ago
Reply to  thinkaboutit

Your name will go on the little list!

2
0
Burlington
Burlington
5 years ago
Reply to  Nigel Sherratt

Don’t tell him Pike!

Sorry I couldn’t resist it.

2
0
Crystal Decanter
Crystal Decanter
5 years ago
Reply to  Cecil B

Bake the Snake

1
0
chaos
chaos
5 years ago

Boris Johnson is a fucking evil clown. He, his clown wife-beating dad, and Nut Nut want to reduce the population.. so that the likes of them and Prince Charles can enjoy their nature.

29
0
Spikedee1
Spikedee1
5 years ago
Reply to  chaos

I cycled to the park and there were other people there! Walking and talking!! We are so sorry oh Fat Pig Dictator, we shall remove them at once!!

5
0
PastImperfect
PastImperfect
5 years ago
Reply to  chaos

How many children has Johnson sired?

0
0
Bella Donna
Bella Donna
5 years ago

An excellent video explaining herd immunity.

https://www.anhinternational.org/news/is-there-more-than-one-path-to-herd-immunity/

Isolating and masking people is bad for herd immunity!

11
0
Jane in France
Jane in France
5 years ago

Hospitals are always very busy at this time of year. Surely one reason they are even busier at the moment is because people’s immune systems have been wrecked by ten months of on-again off-again house arrest leading to no exercise, bad food and constant fear. For example, I have a friend in her eighties who was so terrified during the first confinement in March and April that she stayed in her flat and hardly went out even to shop for food. So she got no exercise and ate TV dinners. This was a very lively lady who belonged to all sorts of clubs and walked miles every week. When I saw her in the summer she had put on a huge amount of weight. She will be a lot more susceptible to anything that’s going about this winter than she was in previous years.

29
0
Ganjan21
Ganjan21
5 years ago
Reply to  Jane in France

Exactly, there will be an increase in obesity which will then bring all sorts of heart problems, thus more pressure on the poor NHS.

8
0
JHUNTZ
JHUNTZ
5 years ago
Reply to  Jane in France

Yes, there are many who are utterly miserable and have as much as given up. This is ruinous for the human body.

11
0
Annie
Annie
5 years ago
Reply to  JHUNTZ

https://www.takingcharge.csh.umn.edu/impact-fear-and-anxiety

About how chronic fear affects your health. Published pre-Covid.

7
0
karenovirus
karenovirus
5 years ago

Earlier this week I posted about a local care home that had recently come down with Covid (at the same time as vaccines arrived but that’s another story) having previously been clear.
One of the staff who has recovered and returned to work tells me that

‘unfortunately I took it home to my family and gave it to my little brother, mum and dad (COPD +asthma).
We were all amazed at how mild it was, I used to be really scared of it, we all tested positive but it was no more than a cold, nobody even went to bed and I don’t think we’re going to have any country left soon it’s all such b*ll*cks’.

The residents continue to recover in their rooms apart from two very elderly ladies who were at the end of life anyway and a man who went to hospital because he had a fall.

27
0
thinkaboutit
thinkaboutit
5 years ago
Reply to  karenovirus

Your post really encapsulates the whole of this epidemic. For most people covid is barely noticeable. If it hadn’t been labelled covid and without MSM none of us would have known it was a bad flu season.

And the elderly with failing health will often die from a respiratory infection. These germs are all around us all the time. The reason we don’t succumb is because we have immune systems and are active enough to keep our lungs well exercised and well drained. An 85 year old who is bedbound will always be vulnerable whether it is covid or flu or pneumonia.

14
0
Spikedee1
Spikedee1
5 years ago
Reply to  thinkaboutit

Yes this sentence normally ends with and they caught covid, especially in the MSM. You never get any follow up. My wife said her best mates son 22 yo who lives in London has caught it!!! AND? Oh he had the sniffles and a little cough! So not even as bad as a cold?

5
0
Laurence
Laurence
5 years ago

I think we may be starting to win. Could the message be finally getting through ?. Neil Ferguson is now talking about herd immunity (extract from the Times): ““I think we will see growth rates slow,” Ferguson said. “We may see a decline, and that may be slightly aided by the fact that there is quite a lot of herd immunity in places like London. “Maybe 25% or 30% of the population has now been infected in the first wave and second wave. So that adds to the reduction of transmission.” Andrew Cuomo is easing restrictions in all of New York state apart from NYC, saying that if they don’t ease up now there will be nothing left to open. And the New York Times, the mouthpiece of the liberal establishment ran an article yesterday entitled ‘the future of the coronavirus, an annoying childhood infection ?”, which does what it says on the tin. These are not small victories – these are people and institutions at the heart of the medical and liberal establishments, but of course the advantage is that sheep are easy to herd, so now they’re starting to change direction,…… ! And all to the background of the… Read more »

22
0
JHUNTZ
JHUNTZ
5 years ago
Reply to  Laurence

They are retreating now as they don’t want too many sheep to wake up in March/ April. This has been the greatest wealth transfer in a century with a resoundingly successful test pilot for health fascism.

Regardless of whether we get ‘normal’ back this threat is never going away it’s been too successful for the elites.

18
0
karenovirus
karenovirus
5 years ago
Reply to  Laurence

Yesterday the BBC broadcast Ferguson saying
“100,000 have died so far but only 20% of the population has been infected with Covid . . .”
Left hanging to imply that if the other 80% become infected 400,000 more will die
“Which is why its do important we continue with lockdown until vaccines . . .”.

4
0
Nigel Sherratt
Nigel Sherratt
5 years ago
Reply to  Laurence

Fauci will start walking it back once Hid(d)en/Barris are in WH.

4
0
Spikedee1
Spikedee1
5 years ago
Reply to  Laurence

That line about hospitals being trapped by the stupidly of their pcr test regime and these folk becoming bed blockers was telling. If you keep telling lies to maintain a narrative its going to come and bite you in the ass eventually!!

4
0
PastImperfect
PastImperfect
5 years ago
Reply to  Laurence

Heart attacks and strokes take ten times as many as Covid.

3
0

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